Brand Specific Forums > Hot Spring Spas
2014 Hot Springs Vanguard Advice
DaveMc:
Hot Springs Ace
Thanks for your input--I would welcome a non partisan test of energy efficiency--it seems though that the average buyer is left with "company opinions" instead of a test comparison--say fill competing tubs with 104 Degree water and tell us which one cools faster---what is the cooling rate for each. Don't you think this would tell the truth better than a description of product and method of install for each?
Hot Spring Ace:
--- Quote from: DaveMc on October 02, 2014, 12:54:20 pm ---I'll take your word for #1---I did not substantiate--so according to you--Vanguard has a Titanium heater--fine
#2 Pump size in your mind means nothing---that is just in your mind--bigger is bigger---other factor of course influence th overall effect but pump size DOES mean something---
#3 What's good enough for you---does not set the criteria for a sound decision--your points in this answer are all irrelevant to the point--the point being that more efficient insulation is ---well --- more efficient and it ='s lower cost-- So if Eco Wrap cuts the bill 25%--then it cuts the bill--if your energy is cheap and you don't care--or it is good enough---good for you--but for an apples to apples comparison---"good enough" is not an answer
California btw pays about 0.31 per kw---not 0.07
--- End quote ---
Certainly go for the ECO wrap if it improves the Sundance spa's energy efficiency by 25%, heck even if its only 10% (depending on the up charge of course).
TwinCitiesHotSpring:
--- Quote from: DaveMc on October 02, 2014, 12:54:20 pm ---I'll take your word for #1---I did not substantiate--so according to you--Vanguard has a Titanium heater--fine
#2 Pump size in your mind means nothing---that is just in your mind--bigger is bigger---other factor of course influence th overall effect but pump size DOES mean something---
#3 What's good enough for you---does not set the criteria for a sound decision--your points in this answer are all irrelevant to the point--the point being that more efficient insulation is ---well --- more efficient and it ='s lower cost-- So if Eco Wrap cuts the bill 25%--then it cuts the bill--if your energy is cheap and you don't care--or it is good enough---good for you--but for an apples to apples comparison---"good enough" is not an answer
California btw pays about 0.31 per kw---not 0.07
--- End quote ---
sounds like you have the whole industry figured out...good luck on your purchase
Dr. Spa™ Ret.:
--- Quote from: Hot Spring Ace on October 02, 2014, 12:53:14 pm ---
I'll add to #3 to give more specifics since that was asked for. Most spas that are foam filled use a 1/2 lb insulation and simply fill the cavity with it. Hot Spring uses a dense foam on the shell, on all sides and on the bottom and then fills the inner cavity with the lower density 1/2 lb foam. That layering is largely responsible for the increased energy efficiency and why a spa with just 1/2 lb foam will never insulate as well.
--- End quote ---
ALL the independent information I can find has always said polyurethane foam has an R-value of R-5 to R-6, per inch, regardless of density. You seem to be saying that a much higher density has a much higher R-value. Can you refer me to any independent information I might have missed? (My understanding has always been that the high density foam on the shell is to add to the structural support of the shell, and the bottom layer for durability under the spa [1/2 pound density wouldn't fair well during transportation].)
Hot Spring Ace:
--- Quote from: Dr. Spa™ Ret. on October 02, 2014, 02:21:00 pm ---
--- Quote from: Hot Spring Ace on October 02, 2014, 12:53:14 pm ---
I'll add to #3 to give more specifics since that was asked for. Most spas that are foam filled use a 1/2 lb insulation and simply fill the cavity with it. Hot Spring uses a dense foam on the shell, on all sides and on the bottom and then fills the inner cavity with the lower density 1/2 lb foam. That layering is largely responsible for the increased energy efficiency and why a spa with just 1/2 lb foam will never insulate as well.
--- End quote ---
ALL the independent information I can find has always said polyurethane foam has an R-value of R-5 to R-6, per inch, regardless of density. You seem to be saying that a much higher density has a much higher R-value. Can you refer me to any independent information I might have missed? (My understanding has always been that the high density foam on the shell is to add to the structural support of the shell, and the bottom layer for durability under the spa [1/2 pound density wouldn't fair well during transportation].)
--- End quote ---
No one has independent information, we all know that. It would be great if that came out at some time.
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