Hot Tub Forum
Original => Hot Tub Forum => Topic started by: East_TX_Spa on November 10, 2006, 05:12:18 pm
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A lady came in awhile back looking for a new filter for her 6-person NON-HotSpring Spa. She was trying to filter a 300+ gallon spa with this little feller:
(http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b206/EastTexasSpa/DSC01977.jpg)
Anyobody else have a filter like the one on the right?
Pitiful.....
Terminator
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Maybe she had a 10 HP circ pump pushing 80,000 gallons a day through that little bad boy! :D
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Here's a uranium coated heating element someone was looking to replace:
(http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b206/EastTexasSpa/DSC02123.jpg)
Whole lotta buttcheese on that thang.
Terminator
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A lady came in awhile back looking for a new filter for her 6-person NON-HotSpring Spa. She was trying to filter a 300+ gallon spa with this little feller:
Anyobody else have a filter like the one on the right?
Pitiful.....
Terminator
That looks like a VERY abused MS filter. Other than the obvious abuse, what are you attempting to infer?
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I'm glad Windsurfdog said it first. Is showing a used and abused dirty filter next to a brand new one fair? I can't help but think about when i had my Grandee and every month when i went to rinse my filters out, 1 was dirty and 4 were clean, does that sound like balanced filtration?
The fact is filters are designed to pick up the dirt particles, that's why it's called a filter. There are many factors when it comes to proper filtration and you are showing just 1 part. 15 years of selling Hot Springs has taught me 1 thing, how to take a negative and turn it into a positive. I'm sure all the Hot Spring store owners remember 2001-2002 and the filter problems they had. And I 'm sure they haven't fogot 2000-2001 and the heaters.
This forum is designed to educate the potential hot tub owner and to keep them away from independent Colorado Manufacturers that rhyme with Slim. Besides 80% of the people on this board are owners/sales people and current spa owners. When a current spa owner takes his filter out and sees his filter is dirty he will question his spa purchase. we need to be reinforcing the hot tub industry on this website, not making them feel bad about the hot tub they bought, even Artic owners (tongue firmly in cheek)
I look forward to the debate that follows.
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Ya'll are missing the point. Yes, that's a dirty old filter. Filters get worn out and have to be replaced. I just grabbed the nearest filter in the store to set beside it to show the size difference.
My point is that this tiny little filter, barely bigger than a soup can, is totally insufficient to filter 300+ gallons of water. We use at least 3 of the Tri-X filters on the left to filter the same amount of water. Of course, we filter EVERY DROP ALL THE TIME. It is ridiculous to think that such a large spa is getting adequate filtration from such an itty bitty filter.
The lady told me her spa was a Leisure Bay or Garden Leisure or Leisure somethingorother. I didn't realize MasterSpa used the same type.
Just pitiful..... :(
Terminator
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I'm sure all the Hot Spring store owners remember 2001-2002 and the filter problems they had. And I 'm sure they haven't fogot 2000-2001 and the heaters.
If you're talking about some of the plastic end pieces of the filters that cracked, that was no big deal. It didn't affect the filter's ability but was simply cosmetic. Anyone that brought in a cracked one was given a new one free of charge, no questions asked.
As far as the heaters, a bad connector from the supplier was dealt with and everyone was taken care of free of charge, no questions asked.
When a current spa owner takes his filter out and sees his filter is dirty he will question his spa purchase.
If he does, then he's an idiot. Dirty filters are GREAT, it means they're working. I would be upset if my filters weren't dirty.
Terminator
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Yes Term each person got a new filter..... out of my pocket the former owner of a 2 Hot Spring stores. THis is the point I am making. They are the best of taking a negative and turning it positive. Thank you for the offical Watkins reply.
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Well, I'm not affiliated with Watkins except for being their customer. And we were reimbursed. :)
And negatives happen all the time. The company's that are successful address the situation and resolve it to the customer's satisfaction.
Terminator
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Ya'll are missing the point. Yes, that's a dirty old filter. Filters get worn out and have to be replaced. I just grabbed the nearest filter in the store to set beside it to show the size difference.
Hey Term,
I give you a old machine repair trick. When trying to show the size of something in a photograph stick a extended tape measure in the background that way perception is not an issue. ;)
By the way, that does look like an old Bullfrog filter although its much smaller
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That's fine if you want to show size difference, then say that. But did you mention anything about pleat count or square foot size of the filter. No you didn't because you are a very smart person and a great salesperson, and because of that you gave very little information and let the consumer make their own conclusions on what they saw. Sometimes it's what you don't say that is more powerful.
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Old Term... He knows... Silence is GOLDEN.........
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No you didn't because you are a very smart person and a great salesperson, and because of that you gave very little information and let the consumer make their own conclusions on what they saw. Sometimes it's what you don't say that is more powerful.
Thank you but you are giving me far too much credit as I am not that slick nor do I aspire to be. A lot of what I do on here is flying by the seat of my drawers and I forget that what I'm necessarily thinking doesn't translate well onto the forum. I apologize for any confusion and have posted the dirty Tri-X filters below to try and make amends.
(http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b206/EastTexasSpa/DSC02555.jpg)
Your friend Terminator
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(http://img172.imageshack.us/img172/4182/cimg9711yc5.th.jpg)
Here's one of my LSX filters........looks a lot like the Term's "pitiful" filter. Since I don't have a fancy, new HS filter to put beside it for comparison, I'll tell you it measures 8 inches in diameter x 7 inches tall.
BTW, this one is over 2 years in service and going strong. The LSX uses 2 of these--I have 2 sets of 2 which I alternate so, in reality, this one has only been installed for 1+ year.
So, Term, how big is the "pitiful" filter and why didn't you tell us it was a Leisure Bay filter from the beginning to avoid misunderstandings like this? I hope you understand why I jumped on this considering the "Little Tykes Spa Traveling Road Show" that is currently being such a pain to you and your community. I'm trying my best to not let that scourge be associated with all MS products and dealers in the eyes of the unknowing that may read this forum.
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Old Term... He knows... Silence is GOLDEN.........
And many times, silence can be deceptive....whether intended or not....
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So, Term, how big is the "pitiful" filter and why didn't you tell us it was a Leisure Bay filter from the beginning to avoid misunderstandings like this?
I didn't mention the brand of the spa as I didn't feel it was germane at the time.
I'm not sure how big Little Pity was as the lady took it with her. I just asked if I could take a pic of it real quick and grabbed the nearest filter I could get.
The Tri-X filter is 10" tall and 6" in diameter. I'm guessing that little one was about 4-5 inches tall. It was tiny. I've never seen such a small filter on a spa.
Wasn't trying to get you riled mr. windsurfdog. :) However, I did see some verrrry interesting sites when I drove by this morning....interesting indeed.
Terminator
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That filter shown is actually one of a set of 2 placed on top of each other. Together, it filters the same as a standard filter used by most spas. No mystery here...
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The lady told me she only had one so I believed her. I guess she's a damn dirty liar! >:(
And to think I tried to help her!
Terminator
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Man, you boys really take your size issues seriously!
For what it's worth Term....I thought that was funny..... ;D
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Wasn't trying to get you riled mr. windsurfdog. :) However, I did see some verrrry interesting sites when I drove by this morning....interesting indeed.
Terminator
No prob....Term. Once again, I'm sorry that you are having to deal with the degenerates at this time.....more of an annoyance for you but seriously slimey to any purchasers.
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Man, you boys really take your size issues seriously!
For what it's worth Term....I thought that was funny..... ;D
Are you inferring that Term's big 10 inch rules? ::)
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Now, I have a question...the picture showing the 5 tri-X filters...three have huge loose pleats, the other two have tight pleats that are held in place by a band...exactly how does this system work? Are the larger pleated filters basically gross filters and the finer pleated filters for smaller particles? Darn, I would hate cleaning all those filters...but I imagine the large pleated ones would be relatively simple since the pleats are so open...Educate me here, Term
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The picture of all the filters are just a mishmash of filters I had laying around that I use for our wet models.
The pleated paper cartridges are our old style filters, same as most other folks. The Tri-X filters are made from "a proprietary material that is fibrous in nature" I was told at the factory. Probably made from dead cats for all I know. The Tri-X filters filter by depth instead of just at the paper thin surface. Most of my customers using the old paper cartridges are switching over to the Tri-X.
I can clean 5 Tri-X filters faster than I can clean 2 paper cartridges. Takes about 1 minute per filter with the water hose.
Termy
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Man, you boys really take your size issues seriously!
For what it's worth Term....I thought that was funny..... ;D
Are you inferring that Term's big 10 inch rules? ::)
duh........
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Thanks Term, confuse and abuse!!! :-/
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Term, if this poor lady came in to buy a filter and you could not help her or didn't care to try, why do you mock her filter. I am sure the tub they have works and they enjoy it, because they need a new filter, and their tub probably didn't cost as much as your tub. Is it because you have a very myopic point of view that is only focused on your opinion or sales programing.
I believe the point has been made that this is not an educational critique, but an endorsement for your brand makers filters. In the interest comparison, since you brought this up, what will it cost her to replace all of her filters five times over the years, compared to replacing all 5 of your filter once, maybe $150 compared to $400.
Considering the space that one filter occupys compared to the space that 5 filters occupy may also be a point of comparison for the shopper. I know your brand in not inexpensive and not everyone can afford to buy from you. But to belitte them or berate them in your posts, demonstrates a lack of openess and fainess for the consumer who can not always buy the biggest and the best. I wonder how she felt about your store when she left after seeking help in rplacing her filter? Did you tell her that it was a "downright pitiful filter"?
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Term, if this poor lady came in to buy a filter and you could not help her or didn't care to try, why do you mock her filter. I am sure the tub they have works and they enjoy it, because they need a new filter, and their tub probably didn't cost as much as your tub. Is it because you have a very myopic point of view that is only focused on your opinion or sales programing.
I believe the point has been made that this is not an educational critique, but an endorsement for your brand makers filters. In the interest comparison, since you brought this up, what will it cost her to replace all of her filters five times over the years, compared to replacing all 5 of your filter once, maybe $150 compared to $400.
Considering the space that one filter occupys compared to the space that 5 filters occupy may also be a point of comparison for the shopper. I know your brand in not inexpensive and not everyone can afford to buy from you. But to belitte them or berate them in your posts, demonstrates a lack of openess and fainess for the consumer who can not always buy the biggest and the best. I wonder how she felt about your store when she left after seeking help in rplacing her filter? Did you tell her that it was a "downright pitiful filter"?
Term can get away with this sort of endorsement cuz he's so darned agreeable and likeable, but I, like you, saw this thread as a little bit of a ploy. All's fair in love and war and hot tub forums!
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Wow....I just thought it was funny....now I feel bad for that little overused filter....sigh
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Clover,
Great point you made. Term, what are the chances the lady will ever come back for anything from you. We know You sell the "world's best spa" a Hot springs. But when you do nothing but spew forth the company line your credibility suffers a great deal. Maybe once you could admit that Watkins has made mistakes in the past and quite probably will do so in the future. Most times a little criticism of the (MAN) is appreciated even when we know who butters our bread.
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I know Term and he is the most helpful, understanding and honest guy you could ever hope to meet. I'm sure he pointed that lady in the right direction to help her find what she wanted, you just can't carry every filter for every spa out there. If having a little fun gets you upset, maybe you should jump in your spa and chill a little.
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Yikes! I thought it was funny too - big 'ol spa and one tiny little overworked filter. Lots of size envy in here or something ::)
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We sell 10 or so of those little guys per month at the store. 500 gallon Thermodusters use TWO! ;D
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Busty today, just have a second:
We don't carry products for anything but OUR customers. When someone comes in with parts from an off-brand or lesser-brand spa, I give them websites and information to help them since their original dealer won't help them. I treat them right, don't belittle them, and always tell them if they don't find what they're looking for to call me back and we'll try something else. This approach has generated a few new customers for me over the years. I do not treat ANYONE badly so ya'll are way off base on that crap.
I wasn't comparing the Tri-X filter to that one in any way except the size. It was the smallest filter I'd ever seen and I couldn't imagine anybody trying to filter that much water with that little pos. I didn't tell the lady that, I gave her the web address to Pleatco and Unicel. I refer a ton of people to Doc's website that are looking for covers and parts for their spas.
Anyway, Happy Veteran's Day and thank all the men and women who serve our country!
Terminator (The Kind and Benevolent)
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Oh, and the arm, I don't spout any company line except East Texas Spa's. Watkins doesn't do everything perfect and I've pointed out a few times when they didn't (SpAudio I for example). But I'll tell you what, overall they've done it better than anyone else longer than anyone else, and that's why they've been #1 for 20 straight years. There's been some hiccups along the way, but when there's a problem, they fix it.
THAT is what makes an industry leader.
Terminator
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I am just glad to have a leisure bay tub with 1 pleaded filter.
but i need to say. it is not that small