Hot Tub Forum
Original => Hot Tub Forum => Topic started by: slimchance on November 08, 2006, 08:08:21 pm
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November first will mark the one month anniversary of my Jacuzzi purchase. Up till now it’s still is not working properly. :-/
The dealer has been corresponding with me through phone calls and coming out to the house to service the tub several times. They have replaced the "Dallas Chip" that supposedly was the culprit for my weird time issue, but I'm still having problems.
Now that the chip has been replaced the ozinator only works when the tub is going through one of its filtration cycles and the circ pump only comes on when it's calling for heat. The dealer has been trying to correct the issue but it's been almost a month and still having issues. I have left another voicemail with the service tech who has been good about getting back to me. Starting to get a little frustrated though, I thought I made the right choice but I’m second guessing myself now, come on Jacuzzi what gives??? :( :( Am I being impatient? Maybe I need to give the dealer more time to work it out with Jacuzzi...
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Be patient with your dealer. Some issues can be head scratchers for sure. You can be assured that Jacuzzi and your dealer will work to correct the problem. Just keep in touch with your dealer so he knows where you stand on the issue - just don't get pesky or mean. Mean and/or obnoxious people tend to get put at the end of the line.
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I agree with Vanguard about being mean or pesky but you might want to suggest them replace the whole controller. I would talk to them and politely say that the controller may need to be replaced and how many attempts to repair the components before they are willing to replace the controller. Sometimes techs don't see the big picture and are trying to treoubleshoot the problem when replacing the entire "problem" is the quickest and easiest for all.
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Vinny, I disagree for the first time ever with you. If I pay 10k for a tub, I expect it to be working right from the get go. If you are having these issues, I would tell your dealer to come pack it up and send you a new one. You dont need that type of headache, the point of a tub is to relax and get away from stress.
Dont worry about upsetting someone, it was your money, they may be great with you, but they should acknowledge a lemon when they see one.
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Sorry to hear about the ongoing problems with your spa. :(
I'm not sure if it's nationwide or just my dealer but I have a 30 day, no questons asked, money back guarantee on my Jacuzzi.
If you don't have this I would wait it out a little longer (maybe a week or two) and see how things pan out. It seems like they have been good so far. Alot of dealers wouldn't have come out at all yet, much less several times in one month. You have to draw the line somewhere but to get angry at them for something that they the dealer did not build is childish. They seem to be trying to fix it first before calling in the big guys for a replacement control. This is protocal. Btw, If I can remember correctly a J-365 cost around 7K, still alot of money but not close to 10K.
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More than 7 Grand.....an after a month it's still not working right?
Ummmm....gosh that must be frustrating. I feel for ya.
I am sure you're thinking...if this is happening within
30 days of it being brand new....whats it gonna be down the line
after a year, two, or three of usage?
It's dicey because you don't wanna alienate the dealer
but deep down you know "this ain't right".
I believe soon you may need to pay the dealer management/owner
a visit and use the "what would you do if you had just paid over 7
grand for a top of the line brand of hot tub and a month after it's
delivered in prime spa tub soaking season it is still not working properly?".
I pray you don't have to call a lawyer, after-all like someone
already said....we buy these things to get away from the stress.
Good luck and hopefully in 30 days you'll be soaking in a working
properly....new hot tub.
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Bosco,
I hear you but as a service person I still think you have to give people a little time although if the same service person is coming out, it may not be a good thing.
I treat my good customers better than my crappy customers - and it seems lately like I have more crappy customers. I think the problem with service is that we, service techs, are a lot of times pressured to save money no matter what. And the quality of service techs vary GREATLY - in my industry, we are not created equal.
I am assigned to one site and I have 2 techs under me. - there are many times that I need to resolve issues that they may have caused either because they were just doing their job or they were lousy at it. I don't even want to get into the money end of it ... it seems that's all that matters.
My comment about requesting a new controller is a way to put pressure on the dealer to realize you are not happy - hopefully they would realize that by voicing your concern and requesting a controller, you are growing inpatient. I akso think that there has to be a firm understanding by the dealer that you want the tub fixed properly in the shortest amount of time.
I agree that ultimately if the tub doesn't get fixed properly in a fixed time period (give the dealer 2 weeks or so to get whatever they think they need) that a new tub should be the solution.
Sometimes we as people become pacifists and don't speak our minds - that's when problems fester and we get screwed. I also have no problems with speaking up to get something corrected but I think that we need to give people a chance first to correct the problem.
Vinny
Altough sometimes I wish I had a gun .... ;D
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Vinny, I disagree for the first time ever with you. If I pay 10k for a tub, I expect it to be working right from the get go. If you are having these issues, I would tell your dealer to come pack it up and send you a new one. You dont need that type of headache, the point of a tub is to relax and get away from stress.
Dont worry about upsetting someone, it was your money, they may be great with you, but they should acknowledge a lemon when they see one.
So if your computer chip went out in your car, you would simply call the manufacturer and have them send you out a new car. Good Luck. No car dealership would do that so why would a spa dealer.
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actually I purchased a VW Jetta in 2001. My car was in the shop 13 times in the first month and a half. I complained to the store with no luck. I finally had enough, it was an issue with the turbo. Later a recall issue. I contacted VW Canada, explained my situation to them and my anger abouth my purchase. I explained that it was unacceptable and threatened legal action.
A week later, VW sent me a check for the depreciation value on my car, I traded it back to the dealer for a brand Jetta without a cent coming out of my pocket. So in short, I would demand that when I spend this type of money, that I be taken care of. We are consumers and we have protection.
Most people just dont go the extra mile to get the help. When You go out for dinner and are not satisfied with the meal, you dont get angry with the server, you are dissapointed in the meal. I choose not to pay for my meal but I will tip generously if the service was good.
I dont know why people think they need to settle. Im not telling you to take it out on the dealer, he is the middle man. If it is a respectable company than I believe that the company should back its product.
Vinny, my tub had some small issues when I got it, and I worked with the service department to correct them. I agree with what you are saying, but I think as a consumer you need to draw a line between minor issues and purchasing a lemon.
My 2 cents
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You said the dealer replaced the Dallas chip. Is that an IC on your circiut board? If so is it in a socket? An IC could be tricky to replace in the field. Where I work we use the proper tools to remove one and it would not generally be done on location unless it is in a socket.
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"So if your computer chip went out in your car, you would simply call the manufacturer and have them send you out a new car. Good Luck. No car dealership would do that so why would a spa dealer"
Yeah....if I had spent thousands of dollars and purchased a brand new car and it was not working properly from day one and the vehicle had been serviced by the dealer already in the first month "several times" with no luck and it went on very much longer.....hell yeah I would be asking for a replacement vehicle!
TEXAS LEMON LAW:
Qualification: 4 unsuccessful repairs when 2 occurred within shorter of 1 year or 12,000 miles, + other 2 occur within shorter of 1 year or 12,000 miles immediately following second repair attempt; or 2 unsuccessful repairs of a serious safety defect when 1 occurred within shorter of 1 year or 12,000 miles + other occurred within shorter of 1 year or 12,000 miles immediately following first repair; or 30 calendar days out of service within shorter of 2 years or 24,000 miles + at least 2 attempts were made within shorter of 1 year or 12,000 miles.
Notification/Trigger: Written notice to manufacturer. State-run arbitration mechanism available
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"So if your computer chip went out in your car, you would simply call the manufacturer and have them send you out a new car. Good Luck. No car dealership would do that so why would a spa dealer"
Yeah....if I had spent thousands of dollars and purchased a brand new car and it was not working properly from day one and the vehicle had been serviced by the dealer already in the first month "several times" with no luck and it went on very much longer.....hell yeah I would be asking for a replacement vehicle!
TEXAS LEMON LAW:
Qualification: 4 unsuccessful repairs when 2 occurred within shorter of 1 year or 12,000 miles, + other 2 occur within shorter of 1 year or 12,000 miles immediately following second repair attempt; or 2 unsuccessful repairs of a serious safety defect when 1 occurred within shorter of 1 year or 12,000 miles + other occurred within shorter of 1 year or 12,000 miles immediately following first repair; or 30 calendar days out of service within shorter of 2 years or 24,000 miles + at least 2 attempts were made within shorter of 1 year or 12,000 miles.
Notification/Trigger: Written notice to manufacturer. State-run arbitration mechanism available
thanks so much for clearing that up
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Great dialogue guys, Thanks...
Not sure if maybe I just need to take a deep virtual breath and relax a little. I guess as long as I'm getting service and not being neglected, I should give it a bit more time. How much time I suppose is the real issue??
I'm not sure if I'm loosing faith in the manufacturer for their (lack of) quality control or perhaps it may be inept service techs from the dealer.
The tech that was out to replace the "chip" is not the service manager, just one of is staff. When he installed the chip on Monday he tripped the GFI (which is inside the house, quick disconnect outside). He was unable to fire up the tub after everything was done so he left me a voicemail on my phone and asked me to reset the breaker when I got home. That was when I noticed all the other weird behavior. I set the time again but too soon to tell if it's behaving. I'm sure they will be out again today to look at it. They typically have been doing the work during the day while I'm at work so I'm not sure what they're doing while they're there.
We'll see what transpires today...
I'll keep you posted!
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Be patient with your dealer. Some issues can be head scratchers for sure. You can be assured that Jacuzzi and your dealer will work to correct the problem. Just keep in touch with your dealer so he knows where you stand on the issue - just don't get pesky or mean. Mean and/or obnoxious people tend to get put at the end of the line.
Pesky? It's been a month and the issue is still up in the air.
How can he be assured that Jacuzzi is working with the dealer to correct the problem?
I think he is keeping touch with the dealer so he knows where he stands; The tub has problems and is not operating correctly. It's Jaquizzi's and the dealers obligation to deliver a working tub, So far they have failed. I there is an outstanding ballance due on the tub, I'd be investigating the feesabilty of holding that back.
I'd give them one more chance to correct the problem, and then if it isn't working Id begin to think very serioulsy about sending it back. This should not be the customers problem. I have a very difficult time when a product is broken before you even get use it. and a dealer and manufactuer expect the cusomter to put up with it?
My attitude is: Take it back. Fix it on your own time. Give me a new one. Don't make your problem tub my problem. I think it's pesky and mean on the dealer/maufactuer's part to expect a bad product be accepted by a customer.
why should a customer have to put up with this?
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In my opinion......
I think "patience" can be defined as giving them another month.
Then no rational person could pretend you are being unreasonable.
If a brand new tub is not working after two months of repeated
service calls the "XHIT has hit the fan" and it is time to demand
a new tub or if you prefer a refund.
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I am still not convinced they are able to replace a chip.
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Went home at for lunch today, checked the tub. The ozinator is running, the circ pump is on and the time is accurate. I think the service manager was out this time. He hadn't left a voicemail last time I checked so I called him and left a voicemail for him.
There is only one thing worse then a broken tub... A broken tub that fixes itself! :-?
I[ch8217]ll get to the bottom of this and let you know. Lets hope the manager was out and finally fixed this once and for all.
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With ALL DUE RESPECT, and this is not a direct affront or a criticism to slimchance or his situation, but only an observation of past threads. We do not live in a perfect world and sometimes things do not go as they should. BUT, did you get a Lemon?
Symptoms were discovered… a service call was placed… the tech was out…installed the chip… tripped the GFCI inside the house…was unable to fire up the tub… left me a voicemail… reset the breaker… that’s when I noticed… And, that is when he would have noticed it too. He would have been able to investigate the source or cause of the weird behavior and maybe this would not be an ongoing problem, but he could not reset the breaker inside and he could not check the outcome or operation of the spa. Then again, in another current thread relating to service charges, is it appropriate for service provider to charge for a return trip?
Be gentle and kind, I am only raising an issue not a debate.
While I do appreciate the frustration and disappointment that this represents, this is a catch 22 situation that everyone seems to have an opinion about faulting the maker, the seller and / or the service provider, but this is not necessarily their fault, nor for that matter, the Hot Tub owner, maybe we should point the finger at the electrician. The GFCI that tripped IS INSIDE and this subject has been chewed up one side and down the other with differing points of view over time, as to why, it should be accessible to the service person at the time of service. Arrangements should have been made to have someone home for service if it is decided the GFCI should be inside.
Then again, when something like this happens everybody has something to contribute and this is just my 2 cents worth.
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With ALL DUE RESPECT, and this is not a direct affront or a criticism to slimchance or his situation, but only an observation of past threads. We do not live in a perfect world and sometimes things do not go as they should. BUT, did you get a Lemon?
Symptoms were discovered… a service call was placed… the tech was out…installed the chip… tripped the GFCI inside the house…was unable to fire up the tub… left me a voicemail… reset the breaker… that’s when I noticed… And, that is when he would have noticed it too. He would have been able to investigate the source or cause of the weird behavior and maybe this would not be an ongoing problem, but he could not reset the breaker inside and he could not check the outcome or operation of the spa. Then again, in another current thread relating to service charges, is it appropriate for service provider to charge for a return trip?
Be gentle and kind, I am only raising an issue not a debate.
While I do appreciate the frustration and disappointment that this represents, this is a catch 22 situation that everyone seems to have an opinion about faulting the maker, the seller and / or the service provider, but this is not necessarily their fault, nor for that matter, the Hot Tub owner, maybe we should point the finger at the electrician. The GFCI that tripped IS INSIDE and this subject has been chewed up one side and down the other with differing points of view over time, as to why, it should be accessible to the service person at the time of service. Arrangements should have been made to have someone home for service if it is decided the GFCI should be inside.
Then again, when something like this happens everybody has something to contribute and this is just my 2 cents worth.
Huh? Did I miss something. Where was it stated that the GFCI tripped?
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With ALL DUE RESPECT, and this is not a direct affront or a criticism to slimchance or his situation, but only an observation of past threads. We do not live in a perfect world and sometimes things do not go as they should. BUT, did you get a Lemon?
Symptoms were discovered… a service call was placed… the tech was out…installed the chip… tripped the GFCI inside the house…was unable to fire up the tub… left me a voicemail… reset the breaker… that’s when I noticed… And, that is when he would have noticed it too. He would have been able to investigate the source or cause of the weird behavior and maybe this would not be an ongoing problem, but he could not reset the breaker inside and he could not check the outcome or operation of the spa. Then again, in another current thread relating to service charges, is it appropriate for service provider to charge for a return trip?
Be gentle and kind, I am only raising an issue not a debate.
While I do appreciate the frustration and disappointment that this represents, this is a catch 22 situation that everyone seems to have an opinion about faulting the maker, the seller and / or the service provider, but this is not necessarily their fault, nor for that matter, the Hot Tub owner, maybe we should point the finger at the electrician. The GFCI that tripped IS INSIDE and this subject has been chewed up one side and down the other with differing points of view over time, as to why, it should be accessible to the service person at the time of service. Arrangements should have been made to have someone home for service if it is decided the GFCI should be inside.
Then again, when something like this happens everybody has something to contribute and this is just my 2 cents worth.
Huh? Did I miss something. Where was it stated that the GFCI tripped?
First page, right above your last post ;D
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Well, I feel like an a$$
Unfortunately, it's a feeling that I all too familiar with. :-X
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No prob's drewstar! ;)
Clover also makes a good point, and had I been ignorant or belligerent to the dealer then I suppose his argument is valid, however I have been very patient and courteous when speaking with the dealer as has he with me. Everything has remained very civil to this point. I do believe however that four weeks is plenty of time to get the bugs, (if any), out.
As I right this, I just got out of the tub and everything is almost perfect now. The only thing wrong that I observed is that the ozonator indicator goes out when either of the jet pumps come on. The ozonator continues to operate however for what ever reason, the indicator just disappears. :-?
After the pumps are shut off about 10 minutes later the indicator lights up again.
It’s a bit trivial and I’m not too concerned about it for now. I have called the service manager and politely left him another voicemail.
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HEY!!!
I just made two star general!!!! KOOLL!! What do I win Chuck?? A new control pack? ;D ;D
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Slimchance, at no time did I ever indicate that you were either of the two, however you are a bit frustrated over these issues, as you become acquainted with your new Hot Tub. You are expressing your distraught feelings over a “lemon” which may not be the case. I would point out, you are still able to enjoy a Hot Water soak and that is good news.
It is good, that you have not alienated your relationship over these getting acquainted issues and I am sure that has a large part to do with how you have handled it to this point. I agree you should not have to deal with any glitches or misunderstandings about the operational aspects of your Jacuzzi which is a well thought out piece of equipment that has evolved over some 30 years to what it is today. Most of this should be covered in the owners manual that your reviewed if it was delivered with the hot Tub. You Hot Tub is very similar to many other good quality tubs that are in use.
You dealer should have oriented you to the operation of your Ozone purification system and let you know, as soon as you touch a function button on the control panel to operate the Hot Tub, the production of Ozone is terminated and will reactivate 5 minutes after the last button has been touched. No icon, No electric, No ozone, thus, there is NO ozone being introduced into the tub during use of the Hot Tub.
The presence of air bubbles being injected through the ozone port does not in and of itself indicate the ozonator is working, that is only the plumbing application that continues to introduce the air bubbles, or ozone bubbles into the Hot Tub. As soon as you press a function, electricity to the ozonator is terminated, the icon goes off, but the plumbing is still connected and the bubbles will continue as a plumbing function drawing only air through the ozonator until it reactivates to once again produce ozone molecules.
When the service manager returns your call, you may just want to tell him how much you are enjoying your new tub and that everything seems to be working just great and that you appreciate his service. That just may line you up for a free service call in the future. ;) :)
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Slimchance, at no time did I ever indicate that you were either of the two, however you are a bit frustrated over these issues, as you become acquainted with your new Hot Tub. You are expressing your distraught feelings over a “lemon” which may not be the case. I would point out, you are still able to enjoy a Hot Water soak and that is good news.
It is good, that you have not alienated your relationship over these getting acquainted issues and I am sure that has a large part to do with how you have handled it to this point. I agree you should not have to deal with any glitches or misunderstandings about the operational aspects of your Jacuzzi which is a well thought out piece of equipment that has evolved over some 30 years to what it is today. Most of this should be covered in the owners manual that your reviewed if it was delivered with the hot Tub. You Hot Tub is very similar to many other good quality tubs that are in use.
You dealer should have oriented you to the operation of your Ozone purification system and let you know, as soon as you touch a function button on the control panel to operate the Hot Tub, the production of Ozone is terminated and will reactivate 5 minutes after the last button has been touched. No icon, No electric, No ozone, thus, there is NO ozone being introduced into the tub during use of the Hot Tub.
The presence of air bubbles being injected through the ozone port does not in and of itself indicate the ozonator is working, that is only the plumbing application that continues to introduce the air bubbles, or ozone bubbles into the Hot Tub. As soon as you press a function, electricity to the ozonator is terminated, the icon goes off, but the plumbing is still connected and the bubbles will continue as a plumbing function drawing only air through the ozonator until it reactivates to once again produce ozone molecules.
When the service manager returns your call, you may just want to tell him how much you are enjoying your new tub and that everything seems to be working just great and that you appreciate his service. That just may line you up for a free service call in the future. ;) :)
Well done.
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No prob's drewstar! ;)
Clover also makes a good point, and had I been ignorant or belligerent to the dealer then I suppose his argument is valid, however I have been very patient and courteous when speaking with the dealer as has he with me. Everything has remained very civil to this point. I do believe however that four weeks is plenty of time to get the bugs, (if any), out.
As I right this, I just got out of the tub and everything is almost perfect now. The only thing wrong that I observed is that the ozonator indicator goes out when either of the jet pumps come on. The ozonator continues to operate however for what ever reason, the indicator just disappears. :-?
After the pumps are shut off about 10 minutes later the indicator lights up again.
It’s a bit trivial and I’m not too concerned about it for now. I have called the service manager and politely left him another voicemail.
This is probably normal. Most tubs turn off the ozonator for a time when a button is pushed, mine is for 40 minutes. bubbles do not equal ozone, bubbles equal circ pup is operating.
Sounds like the tub may be fixed.
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Slimchance, at no time did I ever indicate that you were either of the two, however you are a bit frustrated over these issues, as you become acquainted with your new Hot Tub. You are expressing your distraught feelings over a [ch8220]lemon[ch8221] which may not be the case. I would point out, you are still able to enjoy a Hot Water soak and that is good news.
It is good, that you have not alienated your relationship over these getting acquainted issues and I am sure that has a large part to do with how you have handled it to this point. I agree you should not have to deal with any glitches or misunderstandings about the operational aspects of your Jacuzzi which is a well thought out piece of equipment that has evolved over some 30 years to what it is today. Most of this should be covered in the owners manual that your reviewed if it was delivered with the hot Tub. You Hot Tub is very similar to many other good quality tubs that are in use.
You dealer should have oriented you to the operation of your Ozone purification system and let you know, as soon as you touch a function button on the control panel to operate the Hot Tub, the production of Ozone is terminated and will reactivate 5 minutes after the last button has been touched. No icon, No electric, No ozone, thus, there is NO ozone being introduced into the tub during use of the Hot Tub.
The presence of air bubbles being injected through the ozone port does not in and of itself indicate the ozonator is working, that is only the plumbing application that continues to introduce the air bubbles, or ozone bubbles into the Hot Tub. As soon as you press a function, electricity to the ozonator is terminated, the icon goes off, but the plumbing is still connected and the bubbles will continue as a plumbing function drawing only air through the ozonator until it reactivates to once again produce ozone molecules.
When the service manager returns your call, you may just want to tell him how much you are enjoying your new tub and that everything seems to be working just great and that you appreciate his service. That just may line you up for a free service call in the future. ;) :)
Clover, you seem like a very rational individual.
Thank you for the ozone information and I will not question you on it. If that is indeed the case then all the problems have been resolved! ;D
I'm sure once the service manager retrieves his voicemail this morning, he to will explain that to me as you so eloquently have.
The reason why I was concerned about it on my earlier post was that I don[ch8217]t recall the indicator going out before, during jet operation, however I have been known to be in error, (on occasion ;)).
Thanks again to everyone for taking you time to help me with this one!!!
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If I pay 10k for a tub, I expect it to be working right from the get go. If you are having these issues, I would tell your dealer to come pack it up and send you a new one. You dont need that type of headache, the point of a tub is to relax and get away from stress.
Dont worry about upsetting someone, it was your money, they may be great with you, but they should acknowledge a lemon when they see one.
I hate customers like that.
Check the return policy before you take this advice. The dealer did not build the spa. Things some times dont work when they are new. this is why there are warrentys