Hot Tub Forum
Original => Hot Tub Forum => Topic started by: mcmishka on September 28, 2006, 01:15:50 pm
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I was wondering if anyone is familiar with the Caldera Aspire or the Dimension Diplomat hot tubs. We also were considering the HS Vanguard. Help. Are the loungers really great or not that great? Just want to know which is the best tub. Mcmishka
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You should do a wet test of each to see which one fits best for you. All three are good products.
Bill
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We are wet testing the Vanguard and The Dimension One Californian tonight. Can't wait. The Calder/D1 dealer said the heaters poop out on the HS. He does repairs on them at his store. He said it was because of the 100% filtration, the filters need to be replaced yearly or the heater will burn out. Do you know if this is true. Mcmishka
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I've never owned a hotspring but I doubt the truth of that statement. I do have a 93 D1 and replaced the heater 5 years ago.
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The price on the Caldera Aspire with stereo, outside and inside lights was 6500.00 before tax. It is a display, not sure if it was ever wet tested. Is that a good price. The D1 Diplomat was priced at 8000.00. Does anyone know if these are good prices. The Display HS Vanguard is 7000.00 out the door. (last years model on the HS). Mcmishka
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I thought Caldera and Hotsprings were made by the same folks? Are they using the same heater? As far as the no by pass filtration burning out the filters...I never heard that and wonder why that would affect the heater, if anything, wouldn't it affect the pumps? Chas should be able to verify, he sells both, but it sounds like your Caldera dealer is bending the trught a bit?
From what I heard, all 3 of those tubs are considered to be very highly rated. Wet test all of them, look at the features and price, as well as the dealer to help narrow the field.
Loungers? Never had one in either of my tubs. They are obvioulsy not necessary, but some folks like them. It is purely a personal choice. try it and decide for yourself. I think they take up too much real estate in the tub.
Thos prices sound decent to me. Vanguards are usally $1.2K more than that.
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Both sound like good prices to me. I priced a vanguard at 7740 pre tax, and a wet model aspire for 8k pre tax.
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we sell aspire's for $8000 that is a great price.
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Thanks everyone. I just found out there is a floor model HS Envoy for 7599.00. We will wet test this as well. In regards to the heater. The Caldera dealer said that if the filters are not kept clean on the HS that it would ruin the heater. Actually replaced yearly. Because of the 100% filtration. How often do you have to replace filters on the HS? mcmishka
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In regards to the heater. The Caldera dealer said that if the filters are not kept clean on the HS that it would ruin the heater.
There are devices built into all spa plumbing systems so that if there is not sufficent water flow/pressure or if the temp gets too high the heater will be turned off so you will not burn out the heater as you've been told. Let's assume the salesperson is not aware of this because the alternative is that he/she is directly trying to deceive you.
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The price on the Caldera Aspire with stereo, outside and inside lights was 6500.00 before tax. It is a display, not sure if it was ever wet tested. Is that a good price. The D1 Diplomat was priced at 8000.00. Does anyone know if these are good prices. The Display HS Vanguard is 7000.00 out the door. (last years model on the HS). Mcmishka
We had pricing about the same on the Diplomat here in suburban Chicago; $8500 for the Californian and $7500 for the Nautilus. Can't help on the Caldera's as we weren't impressed with their layouts or jets. The HS dealer nearest us was moving and trying to close out a floor model Vanguard for about $6800 so your quotes are in line IMO.
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Those prices are nice. An Aspire in St. Louis is $8099. I liked the Elation myself because of its lounger but the dealer was shady and the price was to high for me.
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The Caldera dealer said that if the filters are not kept clean on the HS that it would ruin the heater. Actually replaced yearly. Because of the 100% filtration.
(http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b206/EastTexasSpa/37ea791b.jpg)
Whoever told you this is full of 100% No-bypass Bull Crap!
Regular paper cartridges last around 3-4 years. I've got one customer who has had her original HotSpring filter (and spa) going on 18 years. She takes very good care of her filter.
The Tri-X Filters are supposed to last 7-10 years, maybe longer with proper care.
Hope this helps! :)
Terminator
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Thanks! All this info is very welcomed and helpful. Does anyone know for sure if there is a slow switch safety to cut off heater if water flow is low due to dirty filters in the Hot Spring Line? The caldera dealer told us there was no safety switches on HS. Just want to know if he is blowing alot of hot air. Mcmishka
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Yes sir, if the filters are clogged, the spa will shut down automatically to protect any of the components from damage. :)
There are a lot of blowhards in this industry, there ain't no denying it! ;D
Any of the 3 spas you mentioned are great spas and you'll be happy with any of them. Just don't buy one from an obvious liar would be my only piece of advice.
Good luck with your search. :)
Terminator
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Thanks Terminator. My husband and I just tried the Vanguard, Envoy, Caspian from HS. We also tried the D1 Californian and a model from Caldera. I floated in the last two way too much. The Caspian foot dome was a little too ticklish for my feet. We liked the Envoy the best and Vanguard 2nd. I would like to wet test the Soveriegn and The Caldera Aspire before making a decision. Thanks again for your help. Mcmishka
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We are wet testing the Vanguard and The Dimension One Californian tonight. Can't wait. The Calder/D1 dealer said the heaters poop out on the HS. He does repairs on them at his store. He said it was because of the 100% filtration, the filters need to be replaced yearly or the heater will burn out. Do you know if this is true. Mcmishka
I learned to only believe about 50% of what spa dealers say, and don't beleive anything they say about spas they do not sell. Do your own research and don't trust the dealers word on anything without confirming. It is to bad that some dealers lie to make a sale. Talk to dealers here that have no chance of getting your sale and you will get better answers. You need to keep the filters clean in any spa brand you get, most recommend cleaning after 1 week on a new spa then monthly depending on use. I wasn't to excited about cleaning lots of filters so I avoided the ones with 5 filters, but they are good spas. The filters themselves should last for several years if you keep them clean. Most spas have low flow sensors and shut down or display a low flow message on the display if the filters are restricting flow. I would go for the feel and take into consideration how you will use the spa. If you will have others over, you may want more room and a lounger takes up a lot of space. You float so much in water that you can lounge in any seat, you don't need a lounger to do that. I have heard that more people making a second spa purchase, purchase spas without loungers.
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I dont get it....how does it make sense for one dealer to be selling Caldera and D1 together, badmothing HS, and yet she has HS dealer locally as well? As Spatech said, the guy is either misinformed....or lying.....but why would Watkins have their products represented at two different local dealers with D1 in the middle of it all?
Sounds like mcmishka is stuck in the middle of an ugly little local war.....
HS brags about 100% no bypass, so customers go to Caldera and ask "why dont you have that?......Caldera comes up with some little soundbyte about why "100% filtration" is no good, and it escalates from there.
I'd run away from someone trying that hard to manipulate the sale.
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Thanks Anne. I like all three products. HS Envoy, D1 Diplomat and Caldera Aspire. Not able to wet test the last two. We are looking for another dealer to see if we can wet test. your tub set up is beautiful!!!!!
Mcmishka
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Thanks Terminator.
You are surely welcome, :) nice lady!
Termy
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Re: the heaters burning out, ask your Caldera dealer what a high-limit on a HS spa is.
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I'd just like to say that I love my Envoy.
(http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c288/imnosupermom/P1010042.jpg)
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Thanks Brookenstein,
We wet tested the Envoy last night and I did some floating. I am 5'3 and my DH is 6'0. My toes would float out of the water while in the lounger if the Moto pressure was lower. If the pressure is high enough to keep my feet somewhat down I would be about 4 inches or more from the headrest. I did love the Moto. Does your body get use to the hot tub so that the floating will diminish? Do you float?
Mcmishka
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Thanks Anne. I like all three products. HS Envoy, D1 Diplomat and Caldera Aspire. Not able to wet test the last two. We are looking for another dealer to see if we can wet test. your tub set up is beautiful!!!!!
Mcmishka
I obviously ended up purchasing something else, but I loved the Envoy- it was a close second for me. I wet tested it 2-3 times, and I wanted to love it more, but the jets were not therapuetic (strong?) enough for me, and the two side seats (ie, not corner seats or the lounger) had jets that were really useless to me. I dont remember the D1 diplomat, but i wet tested the Californian and the Chairman. It was weird- the first wet test they seemed pretty comfy,but when I went back for a second wet test, I think I was being a bit more discerning, because the leg jets in the lounger in the Cal. were itchy and annoying, and the seats were not shaped to let me fully relax. I wet tested 3 calderas, but I dont think the Aspire was one of them. I personally did not like any of them at all, but my reasons were those of personal taste, nothing objective.
Good luck!!!!!
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Thanks Anne,
We may try the Caldera Niagara and the Moorea. What tub do you have and how long have you had it? Mcmishka
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Heaters and filtration. In theory it is possible that if all 5 filters were plugged up at the same time that the loss of flow through an energized heater could result in heater failure. The heater HS uses is titanium and it is extremely durable. Presumably the filters would not suddenly plug up all at once, rather they would slowly lose flow capacity due to neglect. The pumps would be more likely to fail first in a slow deterioration scenario. A sudden 100% plug scenario is difficult to construct.
Terminator's 100% bull crap assessment of the claim of heater failures due to full filtration is 100% right on methinks.
Bill
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Thanks Bill. How do you like your Envoy and how long have you had it? We wet tested it yesterday and I think I need another wet test, I am floating a bit in it. Mostly when the Moto is on low pressure my feet rise up. When on high pressure my feet come back down, however, my head is forward about 6 inches from the head rest. my husband did like the Envoy more than the Vanguard and Caspian. mcmishka
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Thanks Anne,
We may try the Caldera Niagara and the Moorea. What tub do you have and how long have you had it? Mcmishka
I have an Arctic Legend Extreme, purchased as a floor model, have had it about 8 months, and it took 2 months of researching and shopping and considering to come up with the right choice for me. All of the brands that you are considering are ones that get a lot of positive comments here. My choice was base on narrowing down to the ones I percieved as the best made and supported, and then it was all about comfort and a little about appearance. I wet tested a few tubs 3 times, including the one I finally bought.
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Hi, we are new owners of a D1 Diplomat, 5 months. We love the loungers, my wife does not float in the smaller lounger of the two. It is smaller than the ones in the other D1 tubs. I would highly recommend wet testing the Diplomat so that you would be able to test actually what you would be buying. All other aspects of the D1 are top shelf.
I especially like lying in the lounger and looking up at the stars at night! Good luck with your search!
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Thanks Brookenstein,
We wet tested the Envoy last night and I did some floating. I am 5'3 and my DH is 6'0. My toes would float out of the water while in the lounger if the Moto pressure was lower. If the pressure is high enough to keep my feet somewhat down I would be about 4 inches or more from the headrest. I did love the Moto. Does your body get use to the hot tub so that the floating will diminish? Do you float?
Mcmishka
I am about 5' tall 120 lbs and J is 6' 140lbs. We use the button inside the spa and push it 3 times. I believe that basically gives the full power. We never use lower power (less pumps, closed diverters, whatever). I don't fit in the lounger in the traditional sense (my feet don't reach the jets) and so I don't use it in the traditional sense and don't even remember if I sat in it the normal way what would happen. Not sure if that makes sense. When I'm ready to cool off I sit on the knee portion and use the jets in the foot well below to get my foot massage.
My husband loves the lounger and I have to force him out of it every night just to get a few minutes of the moto massage.
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We have the D-1 Diplomat and like it very much.
Plus Side... I am 6'4" and my bride is 5'4". We both found seats that we really liked. The neck flex jets in the corner deep seat is what sold me. I have a stiff neck (tension) and it was the only one that hit me fust right. My wife is much shorter and fits very well and wanted a lounge seat because of the jet placement. She is just as happy. With the two speed pumps, you can get a more or less vigarous massage. It's up to you. Try and find a Diplomat to wet test.
Con side.. Some of the smaller jets can get a little difficult to adjust. I thind they may get sand or something in them, which makes them harder to turn. After a water change, one pump is more difficult to burp and get running. I was in the store and saw the dealer having the same issue, so I know it's not just mine.
I would buy the same model again. If that helps. :)
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Thanks. We will be wet testing a Diplomat this week sometime. They have to transfer the water out of a californian to put into the Diplomat. Helpful comments, thanks. Mcmishka
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My Tri-X filters are into their 3rd year and come out of the dishwasher looking brand new. If the circulation filter gets clogged the heater and circulation pump do shut down and the power and ready lights flash. Happened to me when I forgot to use my pre-filter when filling.