Hot Tub Forum
Original => Hot Tub Forum => Topic started by: wmccall on April 06, 2006, 07:37:17 pm
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Does any manufacturer give any warnings to buyers about using a hot tub alone? I checked my Dynasty manual and there was nothing. There was a pretty good safety section in the manual that was well written. But I was suprised there was no such warning.
I'm only suprised in the sense that in this day it seems companies feel they have to go overboard with such warnings. Partly I'm sure to protect people, and equally to cover their backsides. I know somewhere there is a Toaster that comes with the warning "Do not use in the bathtub" I know it exists, I've seen it!
Disclaimers like the one above make you wonder where the line of common sense starts and ends. In that line, I'm surprised there is no warning printed. Maybe other manufacturers do, does yours?
Perhaps hot tub manufacturers know that a significant percentage of the normal use of thier product is a solitary one.
I recently became aware that I used my tub alone several times during a 2-3 month period when I was at a significantly high possability of having a grand mal seizure. For those not aware, this type of seizure, at least in my case causes a loss of consciousness, or at the very least awareness and control, for up to 30 minutes. From my experience, it is highly likely that such a seizure while in a hot tub alone would be fatal.
I'm pretty sure that my wife, knowing my beliefs in personal responsibility, would not have sued Dynasty. But I have to think it wouldn't be hard to file such a case and get a victory or settlement.
I would think that this message would serve to protect my spa manufacturer in this case as I'm here admitting I am using the product and acknowledging the risks.
In my own case, I had a seizure back in 1999 and then went more than 4 years without another. My Nuerologist makes me feel he views patience as a necessary evil if a certain lifestyle is to be maintained. ;) I stopped taking my meds and 2 months later it was lights out again. Fortunately I was sitting at my computer at the time (probably posting here).
I've never had a problem while taking my meds and now that I won't do that again I plan on still using my hot tub alone on occasion. I have a known increased risk, but it is under control. There are a lot of things in life that had a risk when doing alone, like driving to work. But life must go on.
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As a pilot for twenty years, we have laws and rules that protect the general public from people like yourself from piloting an airplane. (you wouldn't pass the physical). Are you saying we should have laws that would keep you from behind an auto or out of a hot tub? And if there wasn't a law for this your wife could sue? And maybe win. Where is your common sense man? Stay out of the tub and out of your car when your alone. If you can't control your consciousness, you are a danger to yourself and others.
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Did you read the entire message? I didn't say a thing about laws. My question was more about liability, and I hoped thought provoking. It is an obvious fact that people have sued and won over far more ridiculous things.
As for laws regarding me driving, oddly enough that varies considerably from state to state. I've never understood our form of government in that whether some things are legal or not depend on what side of a border you are on.
I can control my conciousness, that is what the medication is for. I am probably no more of a risk behind the wheel of a car than you are now. 10% of Americans may have a seizure in their lifetime and there frequently are no warning signs. Using your logic nobody should be driving or flying solo. I have plenty of common sense and personal responsibility.
I've said here twice recently that electronic communication can be misinterpreted and when it doubt assume the best. But that last line comes accross to me as ignorant. (Ignorance as in the lack of knowledge of a subject)
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I grabbed my spa manual and it has a lot of warnings and cautions with one of them being about hypothermia and drowning with "do not use your spa alone" as a sentence under it.
It has warnings for everything: medications, alcohol, pregnancy (not the getting pregnant part), obesity (this one's for me ;D), staying too long in water over 100º ...
Surprisingly it didn't have anything about Skylab falling out of the sky, Federal survailance devices too close to the tub or other possible nasties.
I guess as Lawyers get involved with more stupid cases, these warnings will get longer and longer. One day the manual will be 500 pages long and a paragraph will be in there, right before the warranty that explains how to operate the spa ... the rest will be warnings.
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I grabbed my spa manual and it has a lot of warnings and cautions with one of them being about hypothermia and drowning with "do not use your spa alone" as a sentence under it.
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Yours sounded a lot like mine, so I rechecked it and nothing about alone. I've recently become aware that while sleep medications vary quite a bit, the warnings are word for word the same. Oh, by the way, one side effect of sleeping pills is drowsiness. As silly as that sounds there is good reasons that is listed, it just isn't worded real well.
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As for laws regarding me driving, oddly enough that varies considerably from state to state. I've never understood our form of government in that whether some things are legal or not depend on what side of a border you are on.
Don't get me started. I'll probably embarass myself. :D
Let's just say there is no way in the world the "little guy's" voice would be heard without a localized government (little is not necessarily an economic adjective).
Regarding your original post. I've not read any spa manuals with a fine tooth comb. I'd think the warnings to folks taking medications, alcohol, extended stays, too high water temp., etc. might suffice.
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I saw a program once about how stupid people can be and why these warnings are there.
I think most good citizens of the world can be trusted to do the right thing ... everybody isn't a good citizen.
The women sues McDonalds for burning herself on hot coffee ... she wins, now there's a warning.
As you read medication bottles, READ them, some will tell you take a pill with water orally ... someone didn't know that and that's why it's there.
Car's with air bags have warnings about placing a baby in the front seat ... I thought ALL children under a certain height and weight needed to be in the back seat. How about those people who don't have their kids seatbelted.
My spa came with a sign to be posted about some of the warnings. My AG pool had a HUGE sign to post where visible.
I'm sure that the list goes on and on.
BTW, I just came back from soaking alone and I had trouble getting out of my wet bathing suit, I almost fell ... I didn't see that as a warning! ;D
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I guess as Lawyers get involved with more stupid cases, these warnings will get longer and longer.
... and stupider.
We bought a sun screen to put in our windshield to keep the sun out of the mini-van when in Florida. It is about a 1/4 inch thick, coated with reflective aluminum on both sides. It fills the windshield from side to side and top to bottom.
The label said:
[size=24]Remove before driving[/size]
Honest, it did!!!
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I grabbed my spa manual and it has a lot of warnings and cautions with one of them being about hypothermia
Vinster, It's not that I want to be picky but "HYPO" means low, therefore: (According to Thesaurus.com)
Hypothermia
[hiypohthermia] A deep body temperature of 35°C or less, measured clinically by a rectal thermometer. It occurs after immersion in cold water...."
"HYPER" thermia would be the danger in a hot tub.
By the way, what's another word for "thesaurus"? ;)
;D ;D ;D
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By the way, what's another word for "thesaurus"? ;)
;D ;D ;D
"a" saurus
as in: Please hand me "the"saurus. Which one? It don't matter, just hand me "a" saurus.
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Hope were not trying out for any darwin awards?
http://www.darwinawards.com/
;D
???
Have a good one
Chuck 55
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My manual says that if you are alone and the jets are off and bubbles appear, you have no one to blame but yourself ;D
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I think that in the case of a known seizure disorder such as epilepsy, that if one was under a doctor's care, then seized and as a result died in a hot tub, that the doctor would have more concerns about getting sued than the tub manufacturer. Partially because the responsibility for having communicated the danger sits more with him or her, but also partially because there would be more money to be had.
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Surprisingly it didn't have anything about Skylab falling out of the sky, Federal survailance devices too close to the tub or other possible nasties.
Now you know why I wear that funny looking tin foil hat in my tub. And all the neighbors though I was goofed up. But I will show them/thar. No aaliens or beurocrats gonaa get in my heaeed.
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Vinster, It's not that I want to be picky but "HYPO" means low, therefore: (According to Thesaurus.com)
Hypothermia
[hiypohthermia] A deep body temperature of 35°C or less, measured clinically by a rectal thermometer. It occurs after immersion in cold water...."
"HYPER" thermia would be the danger in a hot tub.
By the way, what's another word for "thesaurus"? ;)
;D ;D ;D
My tub has cooling capabilities!! ;)
We're even now! ;D
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As I read this, I am thinking about a thought my husband and I have had. He often goes in alone and while I ususally peek out to check on him, sometimes I get busy and forget he is even out there. Usually I am checking to see if he needs another drink. Sometimes the two of us are out there and might like to check on what's going on with the kids in the house. In any case,
we were thinking about a wireless intercom system so that we could communicate to and from the house. I know this sounds nuts with the tub only feet from the door but it could serve a function in an emergency, as well as to call the "maid" for more refreshments! I know about the electric concerns, so it would have to be water resistant as well as wireless.....mmmmwhat's that goofy inventor show??? ;D
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Vinny,
FYI, when your temp readout says "66" you are probably looking at it upside down.
;D ;D :P
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Disclaimers like the one above make you wonder where the line of common sense starts and ends.
I am a firm beliver that common sense and personal resposiblty starts and ends with that goofy looking guy in the mirror.
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Actually, even if there is a printed warning, a lawsuit is possible in the event of a loss. The reason we engineers can't make things idiot proof is that the idiots are so creative. Lawyers live on the inevitable human misery that follows the creative idiot who suffers a loss. And every idiot in this country is entitle to a hearing before a jury of his peers (i.e. 12 more idiots).
The only answer is tort reform. And meaningful tort reform is anathema to lawyers who would be out of business in short order were tort law to change. Just in case anyone is not aware, the US Congress is comprised of a body of people who are mostly lawyers. So, if you want to fix this problem find people to vote for who are not lawyers. Good luck. People who are not lawyers don't seem to be breaking their legs to get into politics. 'Tis a sticky wicket.
What irks me is that our lives are so very detrimentally affected by all of this. Medical costs are through the roof because of all the frivolous law suits, large rewards, malpractice insurance, and so on. I gave up mowing my own lawn, something I used to enjoy doing, because some idiot picked up a rotary mower in his hands to trim his hedge and it go away from him and performed major surgery. He got a multimillion dollor settlement. As a result, we have all kinds of levers and gadgets that we have to hold onto or the motor stops running. I hate these contraptions.
Good question Bill.
Bill
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Actually, even if there is a printed warning, a lawsuit is possible in the event of a loss. The reason we engineers can't make things idiot proof is that the idiots are so creative. Lawyers live on the inevitable human misery that follows the creative idiot who suffers a loss. And every idiot in this country is entitle to a hearing before a jury of his peers (i.e. 12 more idiots).
The only answer is tort reform. And meaningful tort reform is anathema to lawyers who would be out of business in short order were tort law to change. Just in case anyone is not aware, the US Congress is comprised of a body of people who are mostly lawyers. So, if you want to fix this problem find people to vote for who are not lawyers. Good luck. People who are not lawyers don't seem to be breaking their legs to get into politics. 'Tis a sticky wicket.
What irks me is that our lives are so very detrimentally affected by all of this. Medical costs are through the roof because of all the frivolous law suits, large rewards, malpractice insurance, and so on. I gave up mowing my own lawn, something I used to enjoy doing, because some idiot picked up a rotary mower in his hands to trim his hedge and it go away from him and performed major surgery. He got a multimillion dollor settlement. As a result, we have all kinds of levers and gadgets that we have to hold onto or the motor stops running. I hate these contraptions.
Good question Bill.
Bill
I agree about the lawyers and politicians, but you forget about the Insurance companies. They weild significant clout and are behind many laws and restrictions.
Saftey interlocks can be disabled, but I think they work. I've have had close calls with my mowers and was happy they were there. otherwise, my screen name might be "lefty" today. ;)
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I agree with Bill and drewstar 100%. I have been sued for a slip and fall that I won in court but cost me 20K to defend myself. He not only sued me but his wife sued me for lack of sex! We had already paid his med. but we were not allowed to tell the jury that. It was clear that they (the lawyer and plaintiff) were out for sucking me dry for everything I had worked for my whole life. You know, follow the money. A lot of people say "I'm going to sue for this and that" and they can. But wait till THEY get sued. I had that suit over my head for two years. Couldn't sleep at night. When we won, it was like, well I can't express in words how we felt. I have nothing against wmccall, but if there was more common sense in this world it would a much better place. I'll get off the soap box. Had to vent.
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As I read this, I am thinking about a thought my husband and I have had. He often goes in alone and while I ususally peek out to check on him, sometimes I get busy and forget he is even out there. Usually I am checking to see if he needs another drink. Sometimes the two of us are out there and might like to check on what's going on with the kids in the house. In any case,
we were thinking about a wireless intercom system so that we could communicate to and from the house. I know this sounds nuts with the tub only feet from the door but it could serve a function in an emergency, as well as to call the "maid" for more refreshments! I know about the electric concerns, so it would have to be water resistant as well as wireless.....mmmmwhat's that goofy inventor show??? ;D
what about a pair of battery operated walkie talkies?
you can get a nice pair of these for <$40
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My husband said the same thing at dinner tonight. We do already have several sets (and one is water resistant)so that is a great idea. Oh, if our moderator happens to read this thread..get yourself a set for your cruise. If you and your wife go in different directions on the ship and you want to find each other in a flash, the walkie talkie is the ticket. ;D
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"This is Thunder Love to Babycakes.....Babycakes, do you read? Meet me at the bar on Lido deck 3 in 5......Babycakes, meet me at the bar....."
"Babycakes to Thunder Love, that's a big 10-4. But make it Lido deck 3 bar in 45, I'm getting a bikini wax on deck 2..."
;D