Hot Tub Forum
Original => Hot Tub Forum => Topic started by: Skellman on March 23, 2006, 09:29:37 am
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After 3 years I've narrowed it down to two. I'm in southeast Wisconsin.
2005 Marquis Euphoria SA Floor Model
$7500.00 w/cover, cover lift, steps, delivery and one year free chemicals. Verified good service record for dealer. Great seven year full warranty. I've wet-tested in neigbors 05 Euphoria.
2005 Cal Spa C36 Bel Air Still in wrapper.
$4700.00 w/cover, cover lift, steps, delivery and start-up chemicals.
Dealer verified last night the five year full warranty. It's not pro-rated either. They do service themselves and he vowed to put in writing on invoice all of the above.
My body is aching my friends. Your opinions?
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Hands down, the Marquis. I have seen very, very few customer complaints about Marquis. I have heard very, very little good about the other company.
Chaka
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After 3 years I've narrowed it down to two. I'm in southeast Wisconsin.
2005 Marquis Euphoria SA Floor Model
$7500.00 w/cover, cover lift, steps, delivery and one year free chemicals. Verified good service record for dealer. Great seven year full warranty. I've wet-tested in neigbors 05 Euphoria.
2005 Cal Spa C36 Bel Air Still in wrapper.
$4700.00 w/cover, cover lift, steps, delivery and start-up chemicals.
Dealer verified last night the five year full warranty. It's not pro-rated either. They do service themselves and he vowed to put in writing on invoice all of the above.
My body is aching my friends. Your opinions?
Well, if you have any loose change in your pocket, pick a coin, heads = Marquis, tails = Cal.
Otherwise it is pretty difficult for us to help you decide. There is a $2,700 price spread, yet you still consider both. The dealer seems to be sincere and is interested in your business, and you neighbor is obviously happy with his Marquis.
Considering that you will own YOUR decision for a very long time, I might lean toward the Marquis based on the company's reputation and status in the industry.
Which one are YOU leaning toward and why?
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After 3 years I've narrowed it down to two. I'm in southeast Wisconsin.
2005 Marquis Euphoria SA Floor Model
$7500.00
2005 Cal Spa C36 Bel Air Still in wrapper.
$4700.00
Your opinions?
Definitely an odd pairing. If price matters get the Cal Spas and hope the holds up well, if it doesn't get the Marquis since it's gererally considered to be the better quality of the two and from a more reliable company.
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I'm thinkin'.......the Marquis. Several members on here have them, and love them.....I've read MAYBE 2 satisfied comments about Cal Spas.....and far too many complaints about the lack of quality....
It's an investment, and with the amount you're about to put into it, I'd go with the tub with the better customer satisfaction.....but that's just me and my $.02.....
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The hold up is indeed the large discrepancy in price between the two. I can go in and pay cash for the CalSpa. The Marquis will require me to take the 1 year no interest no payment. So, in one year I'll need to come up with about 3k. From my research I believe both are great deals.
But, I believe the Marquis is the better spa. I was hoping to hear from actual owners of both tubs. But, I do value all your opinions. I'm leaning toward the better product (Marquis) and pray my wife increases my allowance.
Another question to ponder about the spas. What's the deal with a Wisconsin resident purchasing in Illinois? I was told I don't have to pay the sales tax from the dealer in Illinos.
Thanks to all who have responded. I do appreciate it.
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Being bias since I own a Marquis, I can only say that I have been extremely satified with my tub and my dealer.
FYI - The dealers are also owners of the company, hence the vested interest and great service.
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You mentioned the warranty on the Cal. The problem I have seen over and over again is that the dealer says one thing about the warranty, but trying to get coverage under the warranty seems to reveal new and exciting reasons why that warranty isn't the one YOU got on your spa. And here in SoCal it is often not the dealer's fault - they really thought they had a unit with a warranty on their hands.
Hope I'm making sense here: I have met many nice folks who thought they had warranty coverage only to discover that the particular Cal Spa they purchased was a blem, a special model, a floor model, a leftover model, or some crazy other thing which negated the warranty they assumed they had.
In your case the Cal is so much cheaper (I'm sure they know what the product is worth) that you could afford to get it with NO warranty and after replacing pumps and heaters you would still be money ahead.
Something to think about.
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Take the $2,700 and put it in some sort of investment. At the end of the five year warranty it could be worth 5k. Worst case you have to pay a $75.00 trip charge each year for the next 5 years for a total of $375.00 (that is if something goes bad EVERY year. It won't happen) If the price of the two units were 1k apart I would say go for the marquis, but for $2,700, GO CAL.
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Take the $2,700 and put it in some sort of investment. At the end of the five year warranty it could be worth 5k. Worst case you have to pay a $75.00 trip charge each year for the next 5 years for a total of $375.00 (that is if something goes bad EVERY year. It won't happen) If the price of the two units were 1k apart I would say go for the marquis, but for $2,700, GO CAL.
I would like to meet your stockbroker. ;D
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In your case the Cal is so much cheaper (I'm sure they know what the product is worth) that you could afford to get it with NO warranty and after replacing pumps and heaters you would still be money ahead.
Something to think about.
True, if you know that ahead of time you can factor it in but as you noted too often the Cal Spa owner is blindsided down the road that their warranty isn't what they assumed (or were led to believe) it to be. Therefore, he should almost assume an added out of pocket expense on the Cal Spas for this comparison and then compare.
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The obvious question: how does a potential Cal-Spa buyer verify what his warranty is? From what Chas says, the dealer isn't always the best source. Is there someone at Cal-Spa Skellman can call before buying?
Jim
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Speaking only of the Marquis ...The Euphoria is a great therapy spa....If Therapy is what your after be sure to wet test. I think if you do your choice will be much easier.....
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SA Euphoria hands down
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One thing I noticed was that when I went to Cal’s website, I could not find a model named C36. I found others with 36 in the name, but none named C36. Could someone post the link to its description?
One thing that I don’t understand is typically when there is this type of discrepancy in the price typically the consumer is comparing apples to oranges. For example, a consumer may compare a $9,000 dollar Hotspring Grandee to a $6,000 dollar Sundance Bahia and wonder why there is such a price discrepancy. Obviously, the best comparison would be the Grandee to the Sundance Optima. Just wondering if I made any sense.
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Just wondering if I made any sense.
Yes, perfectly good sense.
Chaka Pakuni
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http://www.calspas.com/hot_tubs/detail~a~163~b~2006.htm
I think this is the spa. So nevermind with the last post. I would think we may be comparing apples to apples. Dare I say go with the Cal due to price?
Sorry guys, I forgot to pass it down to you…
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The obvious question: how does a potential Cal-Spa buyer verify what his warranty is? From what Chas says, the dealer isn't always the best source. Is there someone at Cal-Spa Skellman can call before buying?
Jim
Have them give you a copy of the warranty and have them write on it "spa s/n# 45XRDFS sold on invoice# 1234 is covered by this warranty" and sign and date it as well.
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Who is the CalSpa dealer? Around these parts the Cal dealer sells them with NO factory warranty!! The warranty is with the dealer only. If yo have a problem with the dealer, you are S.O.L.!!!!!
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http://www.calspas.com/hot_tubs/detail~a~163~b~2006.htm
I think this is the spa. So nevermind with the last post. I would think we may be comparing apples to apples. Dare I say go with the Cal due to price?
Sorry guys, I forgot to pass it down to you…
If you feel this way....Than throw in an Optima or a Grandee or Vista or a 385 Jacuzzi and just go Cal....I do not think it is the same spa....on paper the specs of all of the above are close.....
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My local Arctic dealer used to sell Cal Spas. He quit selling Cal because they would not back their own warranty. Fortunately for the benefit of his customers and because he wants his store to retain a great reputation, he is paying for all warranty repairs out of his own pocket. He has nothing good to say regarding Cal. If you would like to verify what I have just stated you can PM me. I will be happy to give you his name and business phone number.
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I don't know a thing about Cal Spas but I am a Marquis owner. We have an Epic. It is a wonderful spa. The more I use it the more I find I like about it.
I haven't read a lot of positive things about Cal Spas on this forum, and I think this forum gives a broad spectrum of opinions. Of course, you have to find what's best for you in fit and price.
IMO you can't go wrong with the Euphoria!
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I'm thinking everyone has aged and mellowed....not once have I read a post that had "RUNNNNNNNN FORREST, RUNNNNNNNN!!!!!" or "RUN FAR, RUN FAST, RUN LIKE MEXICAN WATER THROUGH A FIRST TIME TOURIST, JUST RUNNNNN!" in regards to Cal Spa....
Guess I'm not the only one that's trying to take a more relaxed approach to posting...
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If you feel this way....Than throw in an Optima or a Grandee or Vista or a 385 Jacuzzi and just go Cal....I do not think it is the same spa....on paper the specs of all of the above are close.....
For a $2,700 dollar difference even if you don’t get a warranty there is an argument to be made to buy the Cal.
I would make the same argument if it were a Sundance Optima or a Hotspring Grandee. The price difference is huge.
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The CalSpa dealer is Great Escape. They're pretty big around these parts. They also sell pools, pool tables outdoor futniture etc.
From what I can tell the spa shown by Chris H looks close but it's my understanding it has jets in the foot well.
Update: I asked to see the CalSpa to possibly wet test and was told it's in their warehouse. Should I be worried? :-/
Thanks again to all who responded. I'll keep reading.
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I would really want to wet test if it was me. When we bought ours we looked for quite a while and thought we would be happy with a HS Vanguard only to find when we wet tested it we did not like it at all. I think it is fair to ask to wet test it if you are really ready to buy it. You should try to test a few others before you test this one, so you have a comparison when you get to test the one you think you want. It is your hard earned money make sure your spending it for what fits YOU best. good luck
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"A cheap price is a shortcut to being cheated." - Chinese proverb.
I would rather pay more for a product that is clearly superior, than to take a chance on a product that is built to a lower standard with the intent of offering a lower price. The low price is more likely to be forgotten much more quickly than the satisfaction of owning something that works well and offers long term satisfaction.
Regards,
Bill
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I would rather pay more for a product that is clearly superior, than to take a chance on a product that is built to a lower standard with the intent of offering a lower price.
Amen!
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There's another saying I see from time to time that goes:
The less filling of poor quality lasts far longer than the great taste of low price's sweetness.
Truer words were never spoketh.
Terminator
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as long as we are playing phrase game.
About 6 years ago one of my employees broke a brand new drill and turned to me and said "(in his broken english) By cheap, Buy twice"
From then on I always got the dewalts instead of the cheepy
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Goes right along with "pay me now or pay me later"
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"it's unwise to pay too much, but it's also unwise to pay too little"
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but hey.....think of it this way.....the money you save NOW will more than cover the cost of the Vaseline you need to buy in the long run..... ;D ;)
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go with your gut!
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After changing my mind ??? several times I've decided that "discretion is the better part of valor". That, or I'm finally willing to get rid of the "cheapskate" tag my wife and friends have labled me with.
99% sure I'll be putting the 5k down on the Euphoria SA tomorrow.
However, noticed very, very minor blemish on two of the seats. Should I be worried? He won't budge on the 7500.00 price tag. I can't recall if anybody commented if that seemed like a good price.
Thanks to all for your advice.
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if he won't budge on the price, you might see if you can get an extra or two in on the deal.....chemicals, step, cover lifter.....if you don't ask, he won't offer.
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Take the $2,700 and put it in some sort of investment. At the end of the five year warranty it could be worth 5k. Worst case you have to pay a $75.00 trip charge each year for the next 5 years for a total of $375.00 (that is if something goes bad EVERY year. It won't happen) If the price of the two units were 1k apart I would say go for the marquis, but for $2,700, GO CAL.
He should own the marquis for at least 10 years, if you divide the 2700 by the # of days in 10 years it comes out to $.74 a day. however in the same 10 years he will have to buy at least one new cal spa.
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Skellman: That is a pretty good deal on the SA Euphoria. We have a few Euphorias for sale for at or over $8000 in Oregon at the factory Marquis stores and they don't include cover lift and steps. Ask them to throw in two sets of extra filters.
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UNBELIEVABLE!
I went to the Marquis dealer yesterday during lunch and all but told them I was buying one of the three 05' Euphorias. Of the three, two were exactly the same. The other had the wood siding instead of plastic.
I was told that someone from corporate wanted one of the two tubs I wanted but, not to worry about it. Took the credit app home and told them I'll be back tomorrow.
Spoke last night with the saleswoman (she's a good friend of ours) and was told that someone bought one of the two right after I left. She also said that the corporate person did indeed want the other one. She also said "if I had only put $500.00 down earlier today". I was coming in today with 5K!!!! I don't get it. ???
That left the tub with the wood siding. I don't want that tub. I want as little maintenance as possible.
Am I being to picky?
I'll be the first to admit I was very precautious and took my time. To me that's just common sense. But, why would someone from corporate want an 05' when they could have their pick of the 06' litter? I guess I'm a little surprized, confused, leary etc!!!!! Will I ever have a hot tub on my empty patio?
I think I just might run an air hose from my compressor to my bath tub.
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UNBELIEVABLE!
I went to the Marquis dealer yesterday during lunch and all but told them I was buying one of the three 05' Euphorias. Of the three, two were exactly the same. The other had the wood siding instead of plastic.
I was told that someone from corporate wanted one of the two tubs I wanted but, not to worry about it. Took the credit app home and told them I'll be back tomorrow.
Spoke last night with the saleswoman (she's a good friend of ours) and was told that someone bought one of the two right after I left. She also said that the corporate person did indeed want the other one. She also said "if I had only put $500.00 down earlier today". I was coming in today with 5K!!!! I don't get it. ???
That left the tub with the wood siding. I don't want that tub. I want as little maintenance as possible.
Am I being to picky?
I'll be the first to admit I was very precautious and took my time. To me that's just common sense. But, why would someone from corporate want an 05' when they could have their pick of the 06' litter? I guess I'm a little surprized, confused, leary etc!!!!! Will I ever have a hot tub on my empty patio?
I think I just might run an air hose from my compressor to my bath tub.
I don't think you are being picky. Side panel material was important to me. While I think the wood sides are absolutley stunning, I've seen how bad they can look if not taken care of. I too did not want to add "Seal and Stain the hot tub" to my growing yearly chores. I am trying to minimalize maitence. 8) .
It's too bad that you missed the Euphorias you had picked out.
Yes. You will get the tub you want. And it will be worth it. (jsut as long as you don't let your emotions get the better of you).
I'm curious, Did the "guy from coporate" put a $500 deposit down? I bet not. Yet he has the tub. :P If they did, then that's a pain, but the dealer did tell you one was spoken for.
However, if a deposit wasn't taken for the corporate tub, I'd be a bit more annoyed...
Are you soured on this dealer? Or what's the next step? PErsonally I'd be a bit peeved that I lost the tub I wanted, esp so if the salesperson "Was a good friend" (I don't do business with close friends, just for this reason. ).
Walk in with $500 put it down on the corporate tub. If they don't want to take your cash, then I'd find another dealer. That's my free advice and rant. >:(
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I agree with Drewstar. Go in with the money and if they won't sell you the corporate tub then move on down the line. I am a Marquis owner and I love my Epic but your "friend" didn't do you any favors.
If you missed out on the tub because you didn't put a deposit down, then there sure better be a deposit from the corporate guy IMO!! I'd want to see it!
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I don't think you are being picky. Side panel material was important to me. While I think the wood sides are absolutley stunning, I've seen how bad they can look if not taken care of. I too did not want to add "Seal and Stain the hot tub" to my growing yearly chores. I am trying to minimalize maitence. 8) .
It's too bad that you missed the Euphorias you had picked out.
Yes. You will get the tub you want. And it will be worth it. (jsut as long as you don't let your emotions get the better of you).
I'm curious, Did the "guy from coporate" put a $500 deposit down? I bet not. Yet he has the tub. :P If they did, then that's a pain, but the dealer did tell you one was spoken for.
However, if a deposit wasn't taken for the corporate tub, I'd be a bit more annoyed...
Are you soured on this dealer? Or what's the next step? PErsonally I'd be a bit peeved that I lost the tub I wanted, esp so if the salesperson "Was a good friend" (I don't do business with close friends, just for this reason. ).
Walk in with $500 put it down on the corporate tub. If they don't want to take your cash, then I'd find another dealer. That's my free advice and rant. >:(
Drewster, Did you say "rant" there is no evidence that the dealer did anything improper. In fact it's the customer that "took to long" and therefor lost out on a great deal.
When a customer comes in and "rants" or somehow implyes that we did something wrong. I secretly hope that customer will just walk out and never come back. It's that kind of customer that no buisness wants.
The customer that comes in with 5k and says "Shoot I should have taken then deal when you offered it to me. Do you think you can help me out in any other way?" Well then you'll see me and all my employees bend WAAAAY over backwards to get that customer the best deal ever.
Since we have already started with the cliche's here is mine "You can catch more bees with honey than you can with lemon
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If the wood is the ship-lap than....It might be worth considering...It actually was an upgrade to get the ship-lap and it is a very high quality cedar that each board is not sprayed but actually individually hand dipped....there is still the need to treat it.....but it is a beautiful finsih...If you can deal with it....than it is really nice....Where we are at we only sold a handful of spas with it as most people do not want to deal with the extra care but for those who do their cabinets are beautiful .....It is a very very high quality wood used.....
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Drewster, Did you say "rant" there is no evidence that the dealer did anything improper. In fact it's the customer that "took to long" and therefor lost out on a great deal.
When a customer comes in and "rants" or somehow implyes that we did something wrong. I secretly hope that customer will just walk out and never come back. It's that kind of customer that no buisness wants.
The customer that comes in with 5k and says "Shoot I should have taken then deal when you offered it to me. Do you think you can help me out in any other way?" Well then you'll see me and all my employees bend WAAAAY over backwards to get that customer the best deal ever.
Since we have already started with the cliche's here is mine "You can catch more bees with honey than you can with lemon
Did you even read my post?
I never said the dealer did anything improper.
I didn't say go in and rip the dealer a new one.
I did tell Skellman I felt bad he missed his deal.
however, if a coporate guy got the tub on resever with no money down, I'd be rippedsh_t. And I think most consumers would agree.
That was my point.
I did ask seklman what he thought. Was he soured on the deal, or the "good friend"?
???
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Did you even read my post?
I never said the dealer did anything improper.
I didn't say go in and rip the dealer a new one.
I did tell Skellman I felt bad he missed his deal.
however, if a coporate guy got the tub on resever with no money down, I'd be rippedsh_t. And I think most consumers would agree.
That was my point.
And my point is that you are speculating, guessing, trying to get the customer to go in with a negative and violant attitude. The part of your post that killed me was the instruction to "RANT". Whats next if that dosent work "Get a gun"?
I can see it in tomorrow's headlines "9 spa salesmen shot, Skellman on the run" ;D
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Personally, I feel that your "friend" at the store should've called you to tell you someone else was willing to put money down on the tub unless you came back in with a deposit...like: "we've got someone here that wants your chosen tub and is willing to put money on it. I told him/her you've got first dibs, but we need you to come in and put money on it now to reserve it."...
Now, if you DIDN'T know the dealer, things would be more "guess you oughta worked quicker"....but this is where friendship gets sticky....sorry to hear that you didn't get "the" tub you wanted....maybe you could cut a sweet deal on the last one?
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I'm not mad at anyone. I took my time as I stated and I'll do it again. I always told them, if someone else comes in to buy, than it's my own fault.
In fact, last year I lost out on a Reward for basically the same reasons. I lived through it. (My neighbor has a Down East I use occasionally)
The only difference is this time I have 5k to put towards whatever tub I buy.
Micah, you make it sound as though I was wrong for making sure I was comfortable with my purchase. I can see where they might be getting tired of me but, too bad!
They've been very patient but, that's what I would expect as a consumer looking to spend several thousand $$$$$$$$.
My question is: Why wouldn't they wait 12 hours and let me put the 5K down today as opposed to the $500.00 they apparently wanted yesterday? It doesn't make sense.
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skellman, I believe it all boils down to this:
"a bird in the hand"
they know you're interested, but the other guy had the cash right away...guess it's time to look around a little more.....that sucks, sorry.
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I always told them, if someone else comes in to buy, than it's my own fault.
Micah, you make it sound as though I was wrong for making sure I was comfortable with my purchase. I can see where they might be getting tired of me but, too bad!
They've been very patient but, that's what I would expect as a consumer looking to spend several thousand $$$$$$$$.
My question is: Why wouldn't they wait 12 hours and let me put the 5K down today as opposed to the $500.00 they apparently wanted yesterday? It doesn't make sense.
Skellman, there is nothing wrong with taking your time. As long as there is no ranting in the store. But in answer to your question: it goes to a saying we in the industry have about a bus. "The b-back Bus" Most customers don't want to be mean so Everyone says "I'll be back" When in reality half of them won't. Since a quote becomes a deal only when it is signed and a deposit is left, and it appears that didn't happen with you. So If another person asks if a unit is availible. There are two answers that are honest, Yes and no. Not maybe.
From what you have said on this board, there is no reason to belive that the dealer has been anything but honest with you. Give them the chance to come up with an alternative for you. Since you are not in a hurry you have a good chance of something coming up that you might like. My BIGGEST advice is to treat them with respect and kindness, Just don't "RANT"
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And my point is that you are speculating, guessing, trying to get the customer to go in with a negative and violant attitude. The part of your post that killed me was the instruction to "RANT". Whats next if that dosent work "Get a gun"?
I can see it in tomorrow's headlines "9 spa salesmen shot, Skellman on the run" ;D
We're mis comunicating my friend. I never advocated being an a-hole in the store. I would never do that, and I did not try to encourage someone else to do it. Sorry if that's how you infered it.
If a dealer is willing to hold a tub for someone without a deposit, while letting a tub go thta you wanted becasue you had no deposit, that's frustrating and a double standard.
Now, We don't know if that happened. So, yea, it's specualtion. (Lord forbid we specualte in this formal forum) :) Personaly, I'd go into the store ready to make a deposit on my tub, If they tell me "nope, Joe Corporate got it without a deposit" I 'd quickly take my money and leave.
If you feel that's over the top or too much, Well, we agree to disagree.
But, it's my money and i've got dozens of tubs and dealers to choose from. ;D
.(upon re-reading my origianal post)
ahhhh... My last line "That's my free advice and rant"
Did you take that to "Rant in the store"? "Rant" is used here to describe my opinon. Replace Rant with "Peeved advice" and perhaps it will make sense. It was not an instruction to go into the store and rant. It was a description of my post.
Wow. you folks must think me the a$$
:-/
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I didn't feel like going back and reading all the posts, and maybe I missed something, but a "real customer" is more important to take off the market then letting some corporate employee getting his pick of the litter. This corporate guy should be able to get any spa he wants when ever he wants it. ??? I'm a little confused about the actions of the dealer. Maybe I should go back and read the whole thing again.
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That's my free advice and rant.
I believe Drewstar was saying "that's HIS (Drewstar) free advice and rant". Drewstar didn't say for Skellman to RANT.
I don't think any dealer will feel like bending over backwards if a customer is out and out rude and demanding but I don't think Drewstar was recommending that.
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I believe Drewstar was saying "that's HIS (Drewstar) free advice and rant". Drewstar didn't say for Skellman to RANT.
I don't think any dealer will feel like bending over backwards if a customer is out and out rude and demanding but I don't think Drewstar was recommending that.
Thank yo cappy. That's exactly what I was saying.
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Drewster,
you have my appology,
I interpeted that you were instructing him to go in and rant. I guess I should start a rule that I must have my second cup of coffee before I post :-[
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Drewster,
you have my appology,
I interpeted that you were instructing him to go in and rant. I guess I should start a rule that I must have my second cup of coffee before I post :-[
As a 20 year Vet of the Internet I will be soon going through my first Internet free week! I've learned to read things twice, interpret it two ways, and assume the better of the two.
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Drewster,
you have my appology,
I interpeted that you were instructing him to go in and rant. I guess I should start a rule that I must have my second cup of coffee before I post :-[
Were cool. Sorry I wasn't clearer. I'm frustrated with myself for not expressing myself better.
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Aw..it's all good. ;D
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I understood you Drew. Dont worry! The dealer is not at fault if a deposit is needed to make a firm deal, then the factory guy should have to put one down for the dealer to hold it and he may have.
Remember to tell customers,, BUY TODAY!! The product you looked at today and want to think about until tomorrow may be the same product that someone looked yesterday and will buy today.
So a sales persons advice to a customer is BUY TODAY!!
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Time for a hug, a long soak, and a cup of international coffee...... ;D
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International coffee? Blech. Let me buy you a beer.
When I first got my tub I was about 90% sure it was the one I wanted. The dealer told me they had one in stock in the warehouse, and since they had 4 stores, there was a chance it could be sold before I made my final decision. I put a $300 deposit on it to hold it and had the salesperson write on the contact "Deposit 100% refundable for 7 days". This way I could go home, think about it, take a final look at the other tub I was looking at and not worry about "loosing" it.