Hot Tub Forum
Original => Hot Tub Forum => Topic started by: Tatooed_Lady on February 14, 2006, 04:59:15 pm
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I'm considering the option of beefing up part of our deck for the hot tub.....it's a bit of an odd shape (fits right in with my odd family) so I've been outside measuring to see what I could get away with, as far as making sure there's still SOME room on it for the family if we DO go this route. One of the questions I've got.....I know Wisconsin is a "we don't need electrocuted hot tubbers in our state" state, and requires that the tub NOT be placed directly under power lines....does anyone know off the top how far the tub is required to be away from lines, or where I could look that bit of info up without drowning in the sea of technical statues jargon?
Also, I'm not 100% sure what the current support system is on the deck...can we beef up just the portion of it where the tub goes (if we decide to install on the deck) instead of the entire thing? It looks to be 2x6 beams (might be more than 6", but it's hard to tell, no light or real access to check under the deck at this time), and I see 14" in between the support boards. I'm guessing that's not going to be enough for a tub that goes just over 2 tons filled without people included? I don't really need exact specs, as I'd imagine getting the building inspector out here to take a peek will give us all the info needed, but I'm looking for general ideas and thoughts.
I figure this will be the easiest on the pocket book, since the deck is already installed....no levelling required, and "just" reinforcing what's already there, IF we can work around the power wire issue.
I'd seriously considered the concrete pad NEXT to the deck (farther from the wires, too), but that may or may not work, as there's a mature tree not too far from the corner of where the pad would wind up, and I don't want to screw around with all this just to have the tree or concrete damaged because of growth.
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The original spot (on the ground) that the tub was going to go is just to the left of the deck....but the tree at the far left of the picture poses a potential hazard.....
(http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e106/TatooedLady/DSCF0050.jpg)
so I figure I'll just have it put up on the deck (after being sure that it'll support the weight), because it's level, there's room and it's a shorter run for electricity....something toward the left hand side of the deck, next to the railing should work alright. The power lines in question are across the yard and can be seen at the right hand side of the deck. The wires are about 4' to the right of where the tub is possibly going to be placed. If that's not enough space, would putting up a fence between the two make it "okay"? We're planning on putting up some sort of privacy fence anyhow....
I'm trying to post pics of the tub, but somehow photobucket only shows the little error box instead of pics...grrrr....
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First I have to say that under the window seems like a good place for the tub. The tub's only about 36 - 40" tall and a 4" thick slab will probably get you to the window sill.
And as far as everything else, go to the local building dept, they'll be able to guide you.
As far as trees, unless the tree is dead - I wouldn't worry about it. I have trees along the whole back of the house and over the deck and tub.
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I can't get TOO close to the house, there's a basement window that can barely be seen right under that window on the left...which is why I figured I'd bring the entire thing about 3-4 feet away from the house (just in case something catastrophic happens, I don't need a wall of water blowing out my crappy basement window.)
That brings the slab out a bit, and the tree is NOT dead (it's very pretty when it's green), but the roots bow the ground up pretty decently in about a 3' radius toward the house (which would be the green area around the tree that I put in the pic...), and I really want to have it installed so there's room to work around it out of the dirt and grass (I know, darned woman can't make her mind up!!!!!)...
So I've got one approximate bid on the concrete job IF I decide to go for that.....for a 10'x12'x4" slab it'll be around $700. He offered to come check the site out, I told him not to bother YET...not until I'm sure what direction to take, anyhow.
Here's a little cruddy draft of what the yard setup is like around that area....
(http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e106/TatooedLady/ROUGHdraft.jpg)
If the tub ran the same direction as the house, there'll still be room for us to use both gates on the deck and still have room left to use the grill and a small patio set...
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Here's my $0.02.
Get a slab the size of the tub + 2" to 4" wider next to the deck. The tub is either 7' or 8' wide. The 12' deck section is wide enough to house the tub and get rid of the railing. Depending on the cut corner's dimension, I would leave the angle and stop it at the tub. And depending on the height of the deck you might be able to forgo steps. If you do not use steps, the tub will take up less space.
Put the equipment side facing any area that has at least 3' clearance for a service tech to get to and have the cover open to the left. The cover can act as a privacy barrier with the correct cover lifter.
The tree is probably far enough away not to interfere but as I said my backyard has mature trees and I was surprised where I found roots.
A tub is not a pool, it should not burst.
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Are you sure that the electric lines you are referring to are electric?
Do not take my word for it, but they almost look like phone and or cable as they are attached directly to the house and no meter either.
You are referring to the cables we can see in the picture, correct?
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Asking this stuff here is okay, but you really need to get in touch with whoever does the building and electrical inspections/permits in your county, city, township, village, whatever.
They have the definitve say on what is allowed and what isn't- all we can do here is guess.
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Assuming that your concern is the tree roots themselves (and the uneven ground / heaving of the concrete that can come with these roots) you"could" do what I did and build a "sandbox" out of treated lumber (you could cut the bottom edges to fit over tree roots as required to keep the top profile level) and fill with crushed unwashed gravel. Only difference is that I dug mine in, staked, and backfilled the sides because it's below a deck. If not backfilled / staked, you'd want to strengthen the structure by tying the sides together and using heavy gauge brackets for the corners to prevent bowing. If the "sandbox" is made of 2 x 6's, centering the tub on a pad that gives a 6" - 8" border will help reduce likelihood of bowing. Just an idea in case the area to the left of the deck is your favorite (you get to keep the deck for other uses too!)
Good luck :)
Steve
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Are you sure that the electric lines you are referring to are electric?
Do not take my word for it, but they almost look like phone and or cable as they are attached directly to the house and no meter either.
You are referring to the cables we can see in the picture, correct?
Yep, those are electric, the meter is hidden behind the edge of the railing on the deck.
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Here in MA you can't put a pool under power lines either. FWIW.
You could consider having the lines moved.
What is the concern with the tree? Keep in mind the tub is $$, and will be with you a long time. If having an aborist come out and clear some limbs, I'd seriously consider it.
Personly, I like your original location next to the deck. IMHO.
I'm just nosey, what is the 3' jog in the deck between the house and deck?
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Well, that still leaves you with several options....
You can have the electric service moved
You could have the electric service buried
You can put it to the left of the deck
Personally, I would build a circular offshoot of the deck around the hot tub in between the 2 trees with the tub sunk in aroung the deck. Put some pea gravel on the ground and go from there. Take out the railing lit up by the sun to access the new deck and if you really wanted to get fancy, put a railing/privacy fence around the new deck. Just don't forget the tire swing and a place to put the boob tube to watch the Packers.
And of course a spot for the grill.
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Okay..I got PART of my question answered....our building inspector is only in the office from 7am til about 9am, so I snuck a call in before he's gone for the day. Around here (southeastern Wisconsin), it's mandatory to have 5' clearance vertically AND horizontally from any/all power lines. Okay, that's one....the OTHER question I had for him regarding the strength of the deck...he said wait til the electrician's here, make a schmatic of it, blah, blah blah......what the....I'd like to have this all rip-roarin' to go BEFORE any electric is run, or the tub gets here....you know, BE PREPARED? Now I get honors of dinking around, trying to make the best decision I can, based on.....educated guesses. DOH! :'(
Well, in any case, wherever we DO wind up finally putting it.....it'll be LEGAL and be the spot we REALLY REALLY want it........(my husband isn't nuts....yet)
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Well, that still leaves you with several options....
You can have the electric service moved
You could have the electric service buried
You can put it to the left of the deck
Personally, I would build a circular offshoot of the deck around the hot tub in between the 2 trees with the tub sunk in aroung the deck. Put some pea gravel on the ground and go from there. Take out the railing lit up by the sun to access the new deck and if you really wanted to get fancy, put a railing/privacy fence around the new deck. Just don't forget the tire swing and a place to put the boob tube to watch the Packers.
And of course a spot for the grill.
I like how you think Spiman, but then I got to the part where you mention the Packers and realized you were not some great thinking guy, but rather just another insane packer fan ;)
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Just because I eat cheese 24/7, drink beer 24/7, eat bratwurst 24/7, ice fish 24/7 and all my clothing and my house are green and gold, my daughters name is Nitschke and my dog, Lombardi eats cheese and drinks beer, does not mean I am an insane Packers fan. 8)
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What is the concern with the tree? Keep in mind the tub is $$, and will be with you a long time. If having an aborist come out and clear some limbs, I'd seriously consider it.
Personly, I like your original location next to the deck. IMHO.
I'm just nosey, what is the 3' jog in the deck between the house and deck?
My concern with the tree is that we've got 3 large trees in a small backyard....I don't want to do any damage to the trees, since any one of the 3 there could easily take out the power lines or part of the house.
Yes, the tub is $$, but I'm not so worried about the tree BRANCHES.....it's more the root system and how not to a) damage it, or b) have a slab or whatever we finally decide on damaged by the root growth.
The jog in the deck at the left side of the house is where they built the deck AROUND the central A/C unit...I know it's weird, and it makes things a little more awkward in trying to place a tub, to be sure.
I like BOTH locations actually...the deck because it's RIGHT THERE....very convenient in/out of the tub, already level, etc... and I like the location next to the deck because then it's not so high up, and we keep the entire deck for use OTHER than grilling and tubbing...
Ooooohhhh, it's times like this I wish my husband would have a definite opinion, other than "whatever you want, honey"!!!!!
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Assuming that your concern is the tree roots themselves (and the uneven ground / heaving of the concrete that can come with these roots) you"could" do what I did and build a "sandbox" out of treated lumber (you could cut the bottom edges to fit over tree roots as required to keep the top profile level) and fill with crushed unwashed gravel.
Okay, how long has your tub been on this? Has it shifted at all? Did you tamp it thoroughly prior to installing the tub? I've considered the gravel pad idea, I'm hesitant because I'm afraid of the one saying:
"If you can't be a good example, be a horrible warning"
*lol*
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Personally, I would build a circular offshoot of the deck around the hot tub in between the 2 trees with the tub sunk in aroung the deck. Put some pea gravel on the ground and go from there. Take out the railing lit up by the sun to access the new deck and if you really wanted to get fancy, put a railing/privacy fence around the new deck. Just don't forget the tire swing and a place to put the boob tube to watch the Packers.
And of course a spot for the grill.
Okay, we're going to just ignore all ideas about moving the electric. *lol* Sorry, it's a sore spot for me, since just before we bought the house we had to get the owners to get it legally run....3' clearance above the garage roof, 10' above the ground, etc...anyhow...ya know, I kind of like that idea....of bringing it out from the chopped corner of the deck, that is....I suppose we could make a pad or have concrete poured first, then build decking in a year or so when we've more time and money....hmmm...crap that means back to the drawing board.....(tire swing and boob tube, however.....are OUT. ;) )
Don't mind me, guys.....when it comes to "big" decisions I always come up with about 400 options, and narrow it from there.....talking through my ideas (good and bad) helps me feel like I've explored EVERY avenue, and have done enough research to do it well and do it RIGHT.
THANK YOU ALL! (any more ideas, feel MORE than free to keep posting......I'll keep reading, and it might be interesting to the other newbies, too!)
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I don't think the hot tub will harm the root system of that tree at all. There may be some roots that need to be cut when pourting the slab, but I find it hard to belive that it would do any damage to the overall tree.
I agree with you about not eating up a lot of the deck space with a hot tub and if you were my friend I'd really push you to put the tub in it's original location. Just my free advice and opinon. ;D
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Free advice of the good kind is ALWAYS welcome in my home! ;) Especially when, as I said in a previous post, the husband isn't going to give his $.02....I think it's his way of staying out of things, so if the final setup doesn't please me, it's not his fault. *lol*
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Cut the tree down.
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Cut the tree down.
See, that's why I said "free advice of the GOOD kind" *lol* Naw, the trees are staying, they ROCK in summer (concrete block house, covered by shade trees in summer = minimal use of central A/C and STILL tolerable heat level)
I COULD, however.....level the house and start over.
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If you decide to level the house and start over, put the tub in first and build around it. It might take twice as long to get the house done, but the tub is the perfect rx for the sore muscles that accompany home building. ;)
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ALRIGHTYYYYY...FINALLY got Photobucket to let me post tub pics....I apologize for the pics on this thread, but I'm all a-tingle. ;)
Say what you will about the shell...but it's perfect for our family!
First: the VERY deeply set seat with neck massage jets under the neck rest (for the tall hubby)
(http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e106/TatooedLady/DSCF0034.jpg)
then the deep set seat with a waterfall under the pillow for me. I LOVE the huge footwell....
it's the main reason we didn't buy one of the smaller tubs
(http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e106/TatooedLady/DSCF0033.jpg)
And one of just the side the cover flips up on...I like the cover
butler idea...just need to make it work with whatever setup we wind up with.
(http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e106/TatooedLady/Dscf0036.jpg)
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Okay, how long has your tub been on this? Has it shifted at all? Did you tamp it thoroughly prior to installing the tub? I've considered the gravel pad idea, I'm hesitant because I'm afraid of the one saying:
"If you can't be a good example, be a horrible warning"
*lol*
The earth in our area has high clay content. It is "undisturbed" as in it hasn't been dug up, so it is very stable. It looks like yours is also "undisturbed" based on the size of your beautiful tree! I didn't tamp except to level out the area I shovelled to accept the sandbox. I also have 2" x 10" treated wood laid flat on top of the gravel. At a weight of say 6500 lbs with people in the tub, the load is "about" .63psi. It has not shifted. It will not shift. Barring unexpected acts of God such as earthquakes ;). It's been in place since late August. My dealer has recommended this method and installed tubs like this in "hundreds" of yards with no problems, "I'm told". Not for everyone, may work well for some. Certainly inexpensive, and a do-it-yourself kinda guy/gal can easily handle the project.
Steve
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Thank you very much, I will certainly keep that method in mind....I'm rather
torn on all this right now (go figure), but I should have a definite plan right
about the time we're done filling the tub, and I say "oh, crap...honey....?"
Such is the way of Murphy's Law, and such is my life, but I wouldn't
trade it for anything!
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I don't know what code is in your town, but it looks like you could touch your power lines from standing on your deck. That arrangement might have been ok "pre-deck" which would have made them much higher than the highest "standing level" underneath them, but I'm surprised they issued a permit for the deck right under those lines.
-Sarge
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Sarge, I hadn't thought about the lines and the deck (2+2 still = 4, I know), just the lines and the tub. But the deck was installed before we moved here, it's on town record with the deck info and all, so it must've been alright with the inspector. The lines are above gutter height, and I personally can't reach even from the deck (15" lift from the ground, and I'm 5'7"). The lines had to be raised to clear the garage roof by 3' and 10' above ground between garage and house per state or town specs. I'm not even worried about the wires, as they're at the far end of the deck from where the 3 or so areas are that I'm considering putting the tub.
Thanks for your input, you make a lot of sense and I'll keep an eye on overhead wires from now on to be sure they don't create any hazard with any future plans we've got. If they do, I guess we'll have to consider running them underground or something.....but until then....it's all in the air. ;)