Hot Tub Forum
Original => Hot Tub Forum => Topic started by: cappykat on November 08, 2005, 10:42:13 am
-
Mendo, Stuart...someone. I'm getting panicked because it sounds as though I need to drain ASAP and I have no idea how to do this. I haven't added anything since the pH down last night.
Many posters are telling me to drain as soon as possible because of the high acidity and I don't know how to do that. Where do I drain the water...remember we have new landscaping. Will it hurt that?
HELP!! I've called my dealer but got voice mail.
-
I don't think you need to panic, Cappycat! Do you have some ph increaser? If you do, read the instructions and follow them to add a dose of it. You should be able to add some every 15 minutes or so. I'd keep the spa circulating and make sure to shift the diverter valves and run all jets, and the air pump intermittently to ensure all passages get flushed as you raise ph. Keep adding a dose at a time until you get a reading on your strips or phenol red test. This will take time, but at least you know that you are reducing the acidity with each addition of ph up. I personally would not drain until I had the ph corrected, but that's just my opinion. If you do this, you'll be improving the situation while you wait for your husband. Chin up ;)
Steve
-
ssbraun,
Is there any reason to add PH up if cappycat is going to dump the water later today?
Will the acidity hurt anything if its simply left alone for a few hours?
Phil
-
I just added 7oz of pH Up...tested, no change. Given the amount of pH Down I added last night, I think it will take the entire bottle.
I don't know how to run the spa. I mean I can turn on the jets, but the spa is programmed to filter and I don't even want to touch that.
The spa has been acidic since last night, so now after reading the posts, I'm concerned about leaving it any longer.
-
Do you have an owners manual? It should tell you how to drain it. Many times it is best to dump the water and start over than adding a multitude of chemicals in an attempt to correct bad water. I don't think you need to be in panic mode.
Haynes
-
You are welcome to call me at work in an hour I will talk you through it if you like?
-
ssbraun,
Is there any reason to add PH up if cappycat is going to dump the water later today?
Will the acidity hurt anything if its simply left alone for a few hours?
Phil
Since the ph is off the scale on the acidic side, I don't know how low it is. I am going by my experience, and that is that with my continued high ph problems, and a tub that hold 600 gallons, 2 doses of 4 teaspoons each, premixed in cool water as per instructions, added 15 minutes apart, will drop my ph from 8.4 to 7.6. Knowing this, 2 lbs. sounds like an awful lot, so I'm guessing that the water is very acidic. I don't pretend to know the ramifications of dumping it on the ground, or leaving it in the spa. I have a strong suspicion, however, that the later is a bad idea, and if it were my spa, I'd be working to correct it asap. I would not dump acidic water in my yard or down my drain, so I personally would try to correct ph first, then drain.
-
Don't panic but do drain it. One of my customers let their pH drop so low that his pillow dissolved as well as the locks on his cover! It can do some damage.
Terminator
-
I just got off the phone with my dealer. He said, "there's an easy way and a hard way to do this. Try to get the pH back up and waste a lot of chemicals or DRAIN IT"!!
He walked me through it and I got the owner's manual out and it's draining as we speak. Geez, I was trying to help the husband out by doing the chems because he's been so busy at work, and I scew it up the first time...LOL!!
I'm not going to let this get me. I took of the panel and released the valve, hooked up the hose and it worked!! Whoo hoo!!
Thanks everyone...you know I'll be back!
-
The power is off, right?
The reason I ask is one of my customers just called. She drained her "HotSpring Landmark jacuzzi" last night and forgot to turn the power off.
Terminator
-
I'm with Term - DRAIN IT! By the time you correct your ph with chems, your TDS will be off the charts.
Run up to LOWE'S and buy a submersible pump. They are cheap and will make your future drains a lot easier.
Hurry and good luck!
-
I turned the power off at the breaker box. Wow...what a morning!!
-
Cappy is concerned about draining it into the new landscaping.
I would recomend that you buy and extra long hose while at the hardware store and don't drain this water into your new shrubs. Can you run the house to the front yard, or som place where it won't damage your new plants?
IF you have city sewage, you could drain in down the drain.
Don't drain it down your drain if you have a septic tank. Do the plants before you drain into a septic tank,
-
Thanks everyone...you know I'll be back!
Hey! That's my quote. 8)
Terminator
-
I guess I need to replace my pH Down since I practically used it all. The brand is ProTeam...is there a better way to buy chems than at Lowe's or a pool supply?
Submersible pump?? I think I'll leave that to my husband. I'm draining into the part of the yard that is fenced off and still looks like a weed factory.
-
Oh gosh, Term...didn't mean to steal your saying. ;) I'm still trying to calm down from all the excitement. :o
-
I guess I need to replace my pH Down since I practically used it all. The brand is ProTeam...is there a better way to buy chems than at Lowe's or a pool supply?
Submersible pump?? I think I'll leave that to my husband. I'm draining into the part of the yard that is fenced off and still looks like a weed factory.
You might have to put some lime down on that area before planting. :)
-
Next question...once the spa is drained should I do anything to clean it? I'm going to do a run to Lowe's so tell me if there's anything I need to get to clean the inside.
Ya'll are the BEST!!
-
I just added 7oz of pH Up...tested, no change.
This can be part of the problem. After adding any chemical to change PH, you have to wait hours before retesting or you end up adding more than you need and a day later it is way off, then you add the opposite, check too soon, then add more and then you add even more and it goes out of wack the other way. It sounds like you have added a ton of chemicals the last day or two and your TDS are going to be high, I would dump and start all over. It might be worth going to Home Depot and getting a submersible pump for around $80 and using that. It empties mine in 30 minutes. With the hose you can take it well out into the lawn.
As long as your sanitizer level is ok, you can live with PH out of wack for a few days till it gets where you want it. Remember, make a change, wait, and test again. I test the next day to be sure.
-
Next question...once the spa is drained should I do anything to clean it? I'm going to do a run to Lowe's so tell me if there's anything I need to get to clean the inside.
Ya'll are the BEST!!
Yes. Best thing is to get some powedered dihyrdogen monoxide.
-
It all started because I read the directions wrong. Why don't manufacturers label directions for spa chemicals according to spa requirements? They give a dosage breakdown based on 10,000 gallons of water. I didn't notice that...just the amount for the different readings of pH...it said 2.5 lbs for a reading of 8.0-8.4. %$#@, I've never done this and I don't know a thing about chemicals. If it had said 2 ozs. that's what I would have added.
Hey, live and learn.
-
Drewstar, what am I suppose to do with that?
-
Drewstar, what am I suppose to do with that?
fill the tub with it.
-
fill the tub with it.
HaaaHaaaaHaaaa!! ;D ;D ;D
-
Yes. Best thing is to get some powedered dihyrdogen monoxide.
fill the tub with it.
You've got to give me a bit more information than just tell me to do something. What does powdered dihyrodogen monoxide do and will it interfere with a bromine spa? If I do this, how much?
-
He's scratching your leg cappykat.
Terminator
-
Term, you need to be careful with the stuff. Here's a quick primer:
* Death due to accidental inhalation of DHMO, even in small quantities.
* Prolonged exposure to solid DHMO causes severe tissue damage.
* Excessive ingestion produces a number of unpleasant though not typically life-threatening side-effects.
* DHMO is a major component of acid rain.
* Gaseous DHMO can cause severe burns.
* Contributes to soil erosion.
* Leads to corrosion and oxidation of many metals.
* Contamination of electrical systems often causes short-circuits.
* Exposure decreases effectiveness of automobile brakes.
* Found in biopsies of pre-cancerous tumors and lesions.
* Often associated with killer cyclones in the U.S. Midwest and elsewhere.
* Thermal variations in DHMO are a suspected contributor to the El Nino weather effect.
http://www.dhmo.org/facts.html
-
Someone besides me has too much time on their hands. It was pretty funny. ;D
Terminator
-
Leave her alone!!!!!! Be nice!!!!!! >:( :) ;D
-
You can rinse it down if you like or towel it off. But you really don't have to do anything except fill it back up.
-
Someone besides me has too much time on their hands. It was pretty funny. ;D
Terminator
It will be funny in a day or 2, but give the girl a few minutes to get of panic mode before you give her a heart attack. ;) She probably already wrote it down and had it on her list of things to get at the store.
-
Brook, this isn't a laughing matter. Anyone who knows anything about Hot tubs has to agree there really isn't anyother way with out it. If shw was to restart her tub without it, I bet her tub would fry.
What is DHMO?
* as an industrial solvent and coolant,
* in nuclear power plants,
* by the U.S. Navy in the propulsion systems of some older vessels,
* by elite athletes to improve performance,
* in the production of Styrofoam,
* in biological and chemical weapons manufacture,
* as a spray-on fire suppressant and retardant,
* in abortion clinics,
* as a major ingredient in many home-brewed bombs,
* as a byproduct of hydrocarbon combustion in furnaces and air conditioning compressor operation,
* in cult rituals,
* by the Church of Scientology on their members and their members' families (although surprisingly, many members recently have contacted DHMO.org to vehemently deny such use),
* by both the KKK and the NAACP during rallies and marches,
* by pedophiles and pornographers (for uses we'd rather not say here),
* by the clientele at a number of homosexual bath houses in New York City and San Francisco,
* historically, in Hitler's death camps in Nazi Germany, and in prisons in Turkey, Serbia, Croatia, Libya, Iraq and Iran,
* in World War II prison camps in Japan, and in prisons in China, for various forms of torture,
* by the Serbian military as authorized by Slobodan Milosevic in their ethnic cleansing campaign,
* by many terrorist organizations,
* in community swimming pools to maintain chemical balance,
* by software engineers, including those producing DICOM software SDKs,
* in animal research laboratories, and
* in pesticide production and distribution.
-
Fine, treat me like that!! I'm outta here...
-
What the hell are you talking about?? Obviously, I'm not getting it!!
-
What the hell are you talking about?? Obviously, I'm not getting it!!
Cappy, its water.
I was pulling your leg, you sounded like you were getting a bit too worked up over this accident and being the thoughtful caring, helpful guy I am I decided the best thing to do was to add fuel to the fire..
sorry
-
Don't worry Cappy I wasn't getting it either... next time say H20 and we'll be ok. :)
-
Damn, Drewstar! :-[ :-[
-
I'm going to eat lunch and have a beer...I need to chill!!!
-
Damn, Drewstar! :-[ :-[
I am sorrry.
-
Damn, Drewstar! :-[ :-[
Somebody needs to whack him on the head with a stick! Powdered water, who ever heard of such.
Terminator
-
Somebody needs to whack him on the head with a stick! Powdered water, who ever heard of such.
Terminator
Not the stick again. I hate the stick. I promise I'll be good. I'll play nice. Anything but the stick.
-
I got your back Cappy. I might only be 4' 12.5", but I'm mighty. ;) Any don't worry Drewstar, I won't use a stick. ;D
-
I got your back Cappy. I might only be 4' 12.5", but I'm mighty. ;) Any don't worry Drewstar, I won't use a stick. ;D
You have my attention.
Hydronium Hydroxide anyone?
sorry.
-
Get the stick...I think he'll like it!
-
Hydronium Hydroxide anyone?
sorry.
Heavy, drewstar. Very heavy. LMAO...
Phil
-
You can rinse it down if you like or towel it off. But you really don't have to do anything except fill it back up.
Tony's right, your tub is just over chem'd, but probably still clean. I wipe mine down with Clorox wipes when refilling in the summer, but you should be able to drain, rinse the filters, and refill.
-
cappykat,
I am sure everything will work out.
You can get spa chems on the web from Dr. Spa.
http://www.rhtubs.com/store/directory.htm
I have ordered from them and the service was excellent, free shipping too.
Hey Doc, can I get some commissions here, of my total <10 posts 2 have been directing people to your store.
;D
Steve
-
For PH up and down, I think it was Vermonter who mentioned that baking soda and white vinegar (acetic acid) are really much cheaper and mild enough for spas. I checked one day last week when the color of the Ph was not quite right and I dropped a little bit of soda in and ooppps, wrong color real strong. So I dropped a drop of vinegar and yes!!!! That was what it needed to get to the right PH. Lots cheaper than branded chemicals.
-
Tubbin...very interesting. I like the idea of milder chems. I'll keep this in mind. Thanks.
-
Hi Cappy, I'm so sorry you had such a bad experience with balancing your spa. I'm sure that once you get it straightened out everything will be fine. And after this, you will be an expert and probably help the rest of us get up and running. I have to tell you, although I have a pool and haven't had any big problems with balancing a large volume of water, I am seriously very nervous about keeping the hot tub right. I know to a degree it must be a trial and error process but I think I may need a refresher course in chemistry. :-/
-
Keep it simple and keep it regular and it should be no more than 10 minutes a week tops. If you use a floater or something like the frog remember to shock weekly and adjust ph......rinse your filters at least once a month, if you have extra use add a some di chlor even if you are using bromine ...it will be fine and will off set the extra bather load and remember adjust in small doses ....NEVER IN POUNDS......just ask the Cat...... ;)
-
Cappy,
Sorry that I didn't get involved in this earlier...It's been an interesting week.
First off, my answer to major water quality issues is always just drain and refill.
Sorry that you went through this however it's a great learning experience.
Second, this isn't rocket science and although I understand that it can be a bit intimidating at first just remember less with more frequency is always better.
Finally, don't go to Loews and get things to clean the spa. Go to your dealer and get the advice and chemicals that are made for it.
BTW, I cheat when I drain my spa....I'm not a fan of waiting on the gravity drains and don't always have a pump so I just keep a 20 ft length of pool vac hose with me. I turn the jets on and hold it up to a jet until it fills then press my hand over the end and drag that end out of the spa and let it siphon. I usually clamp a set of vise grips on the end in the spa to hold it in the water. It works great and you can also use it as a vacuum. Don't forget to shut the breaker off before the water gets below filter level!
If you run into issues like this and I'm not on the forum just email me. The forum has taken a path of non spa related banter lately (although it is fun if you have time) and I don't always have the time to delve through it to get to the important stuff so I haven't been on much.
-
Cappy,
Invest 20 bucks and buy one of the battery operated pumps and run it with the drain going like you just did. It's as simple as turning it on and oputting it in the water. You'll be empty in under 2 hours max. Also, if you get hit with a hurricane, it will come in handy.
-
Thanks, Stuart and Orlandoguy. There were batteries in the $35 pump I bought, so I replaced them and tried again--it worked like a champ. It doesn't empty every bit of water but it's good enough.
I'm guilty of the banter. When I first started on the forum I was only interested in gathering information. I was on a mission then, plus I didn't "know" anyone. I understand what you're saying. I'm sure there are newbies who are like I was in the beginning...just want solid information. Gotta have some fun too!
Thanks for the advice. I have certainly learned my lesson.
-
Do I have to learn EVERY lesson in a week?? I just went out to check to see how the re-fill was going. I walk out the door and what do I see... but water coming out of the drain spigot!! It probably would have been filled up by now. It only took 30 minutes the first time.
Good grief!! I'm normally have it together better than this! ::) ;D
-
Hang in there cappykat! Being the worldly spa professional that I am, from time to time I forget to put the cap on or leave the hose in too long. It happens to the best of us.
Now back to serious spa talk. It is life or death, after all. No more jacking around.
Terminator
-
Hey guys, don't take me wrong....The banter is fun but I can't get through it all to get to the real heart of stuff lately.
That's just me and my schedule, not putting anyone down.
I love the humor ETS has brought to the board but this time of year I can't even get the time to watch a football game. I rarely take a day off, everyone wants to be in their spa right now and we have almost 100 spas in stock. That's all on my shoulders. When the service techs, salespeople and managers all go home I still have to juggle all of the balls...next month should slow down.
I can tell you that Chas, Mendo, JMcD and other owners are in the same boat with me right now and you don't see them around much.
BTW, I'm still in the market for a good...no, I mean Great service tech.
-
It wasn't directed at you Stuart. :)
I realize this is a spa forum and people come here to get answers that will hopefully help them make informed decisions. I try to do what I can to help while having some fun, too.
I'm very fortunate in the fact that all I have to do is sell spas. I don't have to fix them, deliver them, order supplies, do payroll. I work alone at my store and have a lot of free time in between spa sales. Sold a Sumatran, Vista, and Grandee yesterday and a Prodigy this morning so I'm busy, but I have time to do the fun stuff as well! ;D
Terminator
-
...I just went out to check to see how the re-fill was going. I walk out the door and what do I see... but water coming out of the drain spigot!! It probably would have been filled up by now. It only took 30 minutes the first time.
Been there - done that. At the very first fill. I was going to speed things along just before my dealer came out to set the spa up. Well, lo and behold, Marquis opens all the shutoff valves for delivery and I didn't know that. :O I made it a point to wait 40 minutes before checking the water level and found it half filled with water draining down the decking. :P
But I know about the valves now and will never make that mistake again!
Phil
-
HAAA!! I can laugh about all this today. We've all be newbies!
-
HAAA!! I can laugh about all this today. We've all be newbies!
Truer words were never written around here!!!
Slow and steady, cappykat! Small steps are always best!