Hot Tub Forum
Original => Hot Tub Forum => Topic started by: leesweet on October 14, 2005, 09:18:09 am
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Question on how this is supposed to work. Our Max is about a month old, and doing great except:
When we first got it, the control panel Ozone symbol was on, sometimes. Now it's not, ever, that I can see. So, since the manual says nothing about the ozone generator, except that it's an option, I ask the assembled knowledge here:
When is this supposed to be running? 24/7 with the circ pump? During filter cycles? Or other special timing?
And, if it's not working, is the only troubleshooting I can do (myself) pulling the panel and being sure the power lead to it is still plugged in to the main box?
(We just had the dealer out to replace a waterfall washer (water was dripping down the inside); they did both of them and tested it well; but since they are 80 miles away (!), I hate to have them come out again if it's likely a loose plug or something.)
Thanks!
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Do you have ozone? If you do it should be on anytime the circ pump is on.
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Be certain you look for the ozone icon before pressing any buttons. User activation of any component including temprature setting deactivates the ozone and the icon disapears. If you still are not seeing it it may well be a loose wire or a bad ozone unit.
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Thanks... didn't know that (wish the manual was a bit more complete on this subject) about the 'anything turns it off'.
However, I think it's not working. I'll check tonight and just open the small cover end, and take a look. Then I'll check the wiring this weekend.
Appreciate the info. Hm, do you know how long the ozone is off when you use a button?
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I don't know if this applies to your SD but the ozone generation stays off for 1 hour after the last pump button push on my MS.
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Just move pretty much anywhere in Canada, and by the end of October, crabgrass isn't much to worry about!!
( I live in Calgary )
Mark
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Hm.. that's either code or a misplaced post... :)
Anyway...I assume the reason for the delay after a button press is so that no ozone contacts 'people'? That's the only reason I can come up with...
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That is exaclty correct. Anytime any of the pumps are turned on, the ozone shuts off so no ozone is being produced while the spa is being used. Ozone will start back up after pumps off for a while.
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My Maxxus is 3 weeks old and I've never seen an icon. I thought, foolishly I now realize, that the tiny bubbles coming out of the circ ooutput was the ozone. This is on whenever we're in the tub. I know I have ozone, I watch the dealer install a balboa unit myself.
What gives? Are the tiny bubbles ozone? If so is it dangerous to use. If not? How do I know if I have ozone working?
Very confused,
Joma
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The bubbles may or may not be ozone. The mazi injector will draw o2 into the plumbing and make bubbles even if your o3 unit isn't working properly. A bubble stream is not an indication of a working o3ater. Most spas today have a lengthy contact chamber, and use up the ozone before it reaches the body of spa water. It is a toxic gas, but you'd have to be breating it for one heck of a long time before it could do any harm. Sundances contact chamber claims it uses 99% of the ozone before releasing into the vesel, so I wouldn't be too concerned.
My Maxxus is 3 weeks old and I've never seen an icon. I thought, foolishly I now realize, that the tiny bubbles coming out of the circ ooutput was the ozone. This is on whenever we're in the tub. I know I have ozone, I watch the dealer install a balboa unit myself.
What gives? Are the tiny bubbles ozone? If so is it dangerous to use. If not? How do I know if I have ozone working?
Very confused,
Joma
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Also...the icon may not work with a Balboa ozone unit.
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Sundance programs their spas to turn on the ozone only during the filter cycles. So, consult your owners manual and determine when and how long your filter cycles are. The ozone icon will only appear during those periods. Also, unlike many other spas, Sundance's ozone icon only appears if the ozone generator unit is drawing amps(translation: if the icon is present, the unit is working). The icon does not appear just because the unit is supposed to be on. My guess is your ozone unit is not working. Hopefully your dealer installed it properly, my guess is he didn't and it never has worked.
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On my 05 Optima, with a CD ozone unit, there is an audible buzz, whenever the ozonator is operating.
Just remember Sundance also has that summer "overheat" feature. If the actual temperature of the water is 2 degrees higher than the T-stat setting, it will lock out the circulation pump, along with the ozonator.
To check this, you simply have to turn the set point up at or higher than the actual temp of the water. On my tub, the pump/ozonator will come back on, almost immediately.
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Sundance programs their spas to turn on the ozone only during the filter cycles. ....
If that was responding to me, okay, thanks for the details. I thought it ran 24/7 (did someone say that?).
I do know one time when we were heating it up after the first fill, the ozone indicator was on. But, that could have been at 12:00 noon when the filter cycle runs (by default).
I also know another time we were in the spa when the filter cycle started, but, of course the ozone didn't run then because we had used a jet pump! :)
I guess I'll take a look at 6:00 PM tonight and be sure.
(Why the heck doesn't SD document this? I'd expect this would be the source of many calls from new owners to the dealers!)
And, exactly how can you install one of these *wrong*, There's one screw to fasten it to the frame, one hose to connect it to the circ plumbing, and one plug to insert into the bottom of the control box. It would really be hard to 'not install it correctly', I'd think! I know ours is installed right because I looked this weekend. Even reset the GFCI to see if a power flicker confused it. But the 'filter cycle only' story makes sense, since I've not looked at it during a filter cycle recently.
General question: I was under the impression that ozone was better being a 24/7 thing (not running when people are using the spa, I understand that). So, is the two hours/day amount really doing anything?
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Just remember Sundance also has that summer "overheat" feature. If the actual temperature of the water is 2 degrees higher than the T-stat setting, it will lock out the circulation pump, along with the ozonator.
To check this, you simply have to turn the set point up at or higher than the actual temp of the water. On my tub, the pump/ozonator will come back on, almost immediately.
I'm a bit confused by this... if the ozone is only on in a filter cycle, why would the ozone come on when you raise the temp? Aren't you 'pressing a button' so the ozone is off, no matter what? (We're a lot cooler right now than the temps that would cause the summer override, in any case.)
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Sundance programs their spas to turn on the ozone only during the filter cycles.
Incorrect. The ozone is set to run anyime the circulation pump is running. On a 98 corum, if it doesn't have a circulation pump, it uses the low speed on the main pump, which only runs during filter/heat cycles
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Er, so I'm back to "If I open the cover when no one's been in the spa for hours, and the ozone icon isn't on", it's busted.
Yes?
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How long is your circulation pump set to run?
Is your circulation pump running when you open the spa?
If it is, and there is no icon, then your ozone is probably not working.
When it is on, if you take the middle equipment door off, you will hear an audible buzzing sound.
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Circ is 24/7, as it defaulted to, and does run all the time, since we see/feel the output from the nozzle on the lower face of the entry step. Sounds like the ozone is dead (since I don't hear any sounds from the Ozone box at all (and no ozone icon).
Are these units susceptible to failure from, say, power spikes or is perhaps just a normal one of 500 (whatever) early failure?
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Anything electronic is susceptible to power spikes/brownouts.
One thing I might check is the tubing going to the ozone generator. You can make sure there are 2 check valves in place and that the hose goes up above the water level. If for some odd reason the check valves failed, and the hose was not above the water line, water could have made it back into the ozone generator. This is very unlikely though.
Since its under warranty, you could have your dealer just send you one and install it yourself if you do not want them to have to come all the way out. It is a really easy replacement.
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Yeah, it looks fine, valve and tubing-wise. I'll see if they want to do the 'swap by mail', since, as you say, the hardest thing about the replacement is getting the darn panels off with the 18 screws on the front one, and several on the corner one.
I can't see how it could be easier to replace: one screw to mount, one tube to disconnect, one plug that can't be put in wrong. :)
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Well, we've had our Maxxus since Sept 20, and after reading this I go to look and I don't have an ozone icon either! Of course when I got the tub, the bass sub-woofer was disconnected and something else disconnected so the remote for the stereo wouldn't work and also a missing box so the pumps would work with the remote. All of that has been fixed but now it looks like I have something else to check!
So where is the ozone unit? I've attached a pic from when they were hooking mine up.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/1003/airheads/Tub9.jpg)
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The ozone unit is on the left with the "Spa Necessities" marking. The clear tubing coming off of that unit should go up above the water line to create a hartford loop in case the check valves fail.
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Huh, I sez. Mine is behind the panel to the right of the 'access panel' that you have open. That is, it's mounted facing the other way, hanging from one screw inside and to the right.
I guess it's installer preference where it goes.
I assume your box is same as mine, but I can't see the front of it to see the label. The mechanical aspects look exactly the same.
I did notice that my ozone hose/tube is connected to the top fitting, and yours is to the bottom. Why are there two? Is mine backwards? Is yours? :)
(I didn't see any labels on the fittings to say what each was for. If the box is sealed, one could be the O2 (air) inlet and one the O3 (ozone) exit, but you'd think they'd hide the inlet better to avoid installer boo-boos.
Does yours work now that it's plugged in?
This gets more interesting every day. If the only thing that stops the ozonator is the 1-hour delay on push button presses and the circ pump is running, then mine is actually dead. :(
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I haven't determined if my ozone is working yet or not. I have no icon on the display panel, but I do hear a 'buzzing' near the control box. Only thing is, I went out at around 4 PM when no one had been near the tub, heard the buzz, then turned on a pump to see if the buzzing would stop once the pump was turned off. I could still hear the buzz, so to me that indicates that either I'm not hearing the correct noise, or the unit isn't working, or it's working all the time regardless of the jets.
I haven't had time to actually open up the front yet. I took that picture the day the tub was installed.
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Okay, some conflicting info from my Sundance dealer (he was out, which was why I couldn't get to him...).
He says:
1. If you have bubbles coming out the recirc port, the ozone's running. The icon seems to work and not work sometimes (he says), and that doesn't matter.
My comments: Perhaps the SD ozonator takes too little power sometimes and the icon is off? Beats me.
2. Also, there is no cutoff for one hour when you hit a button on the control panel.
My comments: This is why I thought the bubbles were from the circ pump or heater or something, since it bubbled most all the time (perhaps all the time).
He says also he just did this on an Optima in the showroom and the ozone bubbles were on all the time.
So, huh? Is the one-hour-cutoff on older models, or something?
Anyone got a 2005 880 to test this on? I believe the bubbles are ozone (what else could be they be, an air leak?), but why the confusion on the cutoff, etc.?
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We had thought the bubble were ozone at first as well. But from reading the previous posts about the ozone turning off when a button is pressed we changed our minds. We have been watching on our Optima and when we press a button the ozone icon does turn off but the bubbles are still there. They are always there.
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Hm, this gets better and better. So, are the bubbles ozone or not? The other item is that the manuals calls that port the 'waterfall return'. What does that mean? Water comes out of the waterfall. What the heck does 'return' mean in that context? (And we have bubbles all the time, waterfall on or off, also.)
I'll try it tonight with various combinations.
I'm inclined now to think the bubbles we're seeing with the ozone icon off aren't ozone. But I need ammunition to contradict my dealer. :)
Any SD dealers with experience with the '05 880s that can lay this to rest?!
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I hate to do this but your SD dealer is dead wrong regarding bubbles and ozone. The bubbles are caused by the Mazzei injector creating a vacuum and drawing air and/or ozone through the tubing that runs from the ozonator to the injector itself. When the ozone is on (should be when the icon is showing), the ozonator is creating ozone. Air is drawn into the ozonator from one of the two outlets and ozone is drawn out of the ozonator by the injector. If the ozonator is not producing ozone such as when pumps are on, air is still being drawn through the ozonator and through the tubing by the Mazzei Injector into the spa...still creating bubbles. The only difference is that the ozonator is not producting ozone. Inside the spa, you will notice no difference.
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OK ??? I have never seen the ozone icon on my '05 Maxxus. I opened the panel and have the same "spa necessities" ozone unit as pictured in the photo above; same location also. Sundance's website shows a similar shaped unit labelled "Sunzone CD". Is the unit I have the same?; is it a Sundance product or a dealer aftermarket product?; is it a CD unit or UV? The dealer website also indicates a cost of operation of $.04 / day "to operate 24 hours a day". This infers that the unit is running all the time. Like leesweet said...can any dealers "lay this to rest?"
Thanks for any help!!
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It is the same. Spa Necessities seems to be a sales division for accessories for Sundance and JacuzziPremium.
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I'll do my best. The Spa Necessities ozone unit is CD type. If the ozone icon is not appearing, you are NOT producing ozone. The ozone will run (when working properly) 24/7 UNTILL someone presses a button on either control panel. Neither Jacuzzi Premium nor Sundance "manufactur" ozone units, neither do they factory install them. The unit labeled "Sunzone" is the same unit as the Spa Necessities with the Sundance private labeling on it which causes the cost to increase exponentialy. They are after market units.
OK ??? I have never seen the ozone icon on my '05 Maxxus. I opened the panel and have the same "spa necessities" ozone unit as pictured in the photo above; same location also. Sundance's website shows a similar shaped unit labelled "Sunzone CD". Is the unit I have the same?; is it a Sundance product or a dealer aftermarket product?; is it a CD unit or UV? The dealer website also indicates a cost of operation of $.04 / day "to operate 24 hours a day". This infers that the unit is running all the time. Like leesweet said...can any dealers "lay this to rest?"
Thanks for any help!!
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I'll do my best. The Spa Necessities ozone unit is CD type. If the ozone icon is not appearing, you are NOT producing ozone. The ozone will run (when working properly) 24/7 UNTILL someone presses a button on either control panel. Neither Jacuzzi Premium nor Sundance "manufactur" ozone units, neither do they factory install them. The unit labeled "Sunzone" is the same unit as the Spa Necessities with the Sundance private labeling on it which causes the cost to increase exponentialy. They are after market units.
This helps a lot!! Thanks...now since I have no icon and therefore no ozone, is there a programming entry to set up the ozone to run, or is this a problem for the dealer service dept?
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Well, I've seen enough indication on here that something is wrong with the ozone, so I called my Sundance dealer today and they said to the best of their knowledge the ozone icon should be on, so they are sending out a technician to look at it - don't have it scheduled yet, but I will keep you guys updated. Seems like this is a larger issue since there are quite a few Maxxus owners on here with no ozone icon!
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Yup...I've got a call in also...will post any new info
Cheers!
Steve
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I've got Ozone!!!
The repairman came out today and pulled the front cover off of the Maxxus, checked the wiring and voltage, unplugged the old unit and then pulled a new ozone unit from a box and plugged it in. Ozone icon came on immediately and you could hear the ozone coming out of the box. I asked him which of the two outputs you need to use and he said it didn't matter. End result was that the ozone unit I had didn't work so it was replaced. The ozone unit is a dealer installed unit.
The ozone goes off when a pump is turned on. After a pump is run, the ozone comes back on in about 10 minutes.
I would never have thought about it had I not seen this thread, so thanks to everyone! There must be a bunch of '05 Maxxus out there with bad ozone units.
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I've got Ozone!!!
You should be able to decrease your sanitizer use now. I shock, and add two bromine tabs in the feeder once a week. Maintain a 1-ppm total bromine level, and have perfectly clear water.
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Lordy, what a mess... :) I've not taken the front panel off to pull the plug on the ozone (since I need to do so in order to 'prove' to the expert SD salesman that the bubbles are not ozone... :) ).
I know what I'll find, though.
Thank the stars for the Internet. ;)
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Pull the clear tubing that goes from the ozonator to the injector apart. The best place is at the check valve (you may have to change one of these one day). Bubbles will still be present even though no ozone hooked up.