Hot Tub Forum
Original => Hot Tub Forum => Topic started by: Backpains on June 30, 2005, 03:52:19 pm
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As you all know I use my hot tub somewhere between 6 and 7 times a day. My dealer told me today that since I use it so much and am not being able to keep up with the bromine that I should open up the feeder to 6-7 holes and throw the bromine granules in after every use 1/2 tspn. I also need to go up and get some enzyme tablets for the gunk rising to latch onto the sides of my tub (grease, persperation and body oils are causing this)and to grab some more prefilters because my one isn't keeping up very well. So....you all now know if you use it as much as I do then you have to prepare for a little adjustment to your chemical routine!
anyway, that's it for now!
Backpains
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Good to know... what does that add up to in total time? 20 mins a shot? So it's 2 1/2 hours? Or longer? (Sounds like a plan... :) )
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I had bad reactions to Bromine with my old tub. And I was "only" using it several times a week, not per day. I am very, very interested in hearing how this works out for you over the next several weeks.
Isn't Dichlor considered less harsh? Wouldn't that (with a 24 7 ozone and perhaps a silver ion thingy: less caustic chems) be a better set up for you?
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Yeah, what he said.... in our old spa, we used Br, also, and we expect to use the new one more. We didn't have any bad reactions to it, but you never know, and I'm not feeling like I want to change chems in midstream (as it were). So, I'd like to start with the 'least reactive' regimen, even if it perhaps takes a little more work to maintain it.
So, Backpains and anyone else that is 'overexposed' (that possible?) to spa water, let us know how it goes!
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This is why I think next year we will pay to get the ozonator or what Coleman calls a Cleanzone water management system installed. Total time that I'm in the tub a day 120- 140 min (20- 30 minutes at a time, hubby and I sit in it 3 times a day together 30 minutes at a time the jets automatically shut off at 30 min then we know it's time to get out)
So far Drew, it hasn't affected my skin at all in fact, my dry skin has been not as bad as it normally is. so we will watch that part of it. My dealer told me it's not a bad thing taht you spend that much time in the tub, it's just you spend more time in than most people and we have to adjust to acommidate this
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We did have the ozonator in our last spa, and didn't feel water maintenance was a chore, probably just because of that fact. I definitely think it's a help to keep things fresh.
Now, what actual chem family to use is the next question... :)
Glad to hear there haven't been any ill effects so far!
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This is why I think next year we will pay to get the ozonator or what Coleman calls a Cleanzone water management system installed. Total time that I'm in the tub a day 120- 140 min (20- 30 minutes at a time, hubby and I sit in it 3 times a day together 30 minutes at a time the jets automatically shut off at 30 min then we know it's time to get out)
So far Drew, it hasn't affected my skin at all in fact, my dry skin has been not as bad as it normally is. so we will watch that part of it. My dealer told me it's not a bad thing taht you spend that much time in the tub, it's just you spend more time in than most people and we have to adjust to acommidate this
I guess maybe different people react to different chems. I'm just courious. :D Because I want to learn from your experince.
Time will bear out what is the best system for you.
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My opinion has always been, Bromine=yuck, dichlor=better (but others may disagree).
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That's exactly the sort of thing I want to know before I start the next new spa on its chemical way.
I think I read here recently the whole point of Br over Cl. Was it that Br is a bit more stable needing less care or something, so for the average lazy American, it'll keep water more usable?
I don't care if Cl's harder, if it works better. :)
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Backpains;
If you are the primary user, the "gunk" may show up less and less.
It depends what the source is.
If you are moisterizing or applying products to your skin or hair between soaks it may not.
If the "gunk" is your skin purging impurities (this will happen when you use a tub) you will experience the problem less and less.
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One thing to keep in mind when comparing sanitizers---
ph tends to rise in a spa, at the ph of 7.8 (which isn't too out of whack) chlorine is at about 20% effectivness while bromine is at approx. 80% effectivness.
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One thing to keep in mind when comparing sanitizers---
ph tends to rise in a spa, at the ph of 7.8 (which isn't too out of whack) chlorine is at about 20% effectivness while bromine is at approx. 80% effectivness.
While this is true, Chlorine is less likely to raise your pH than Bromine. So its a good thing it is still 80% effective since you are much more likely to have high pH.
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Ok, I never expected this to become a discussion about br vs cl (don't really care who wins that one) I think between the two it's a personal preference as to which on you like best. To me bromine made more sense cause I cannot stand the smell of clorine that's probably the reason I never go to the pool. Both hubby and I use the hot tub, but, I'm the primary user as it does help a bit on my back so, even if I have to clean the darned thing 40 times a day around the edges, then I am willing to do this in order to keep allowing my back to get the benifits of the hot tub. If I sound upset I'm not, just I realize that people have different opinions about both products. I'll go up to Billings probably next week and get some filters, enzymes and more bromine granules.
What I don't understand is my skin is softer now than what it ever has been....go figure something to leave me wondering ;D
Have a great night and happy tubbing.....ooo....and Happy 4th you all!!!
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Backpains,
If you smell chlorine in a pool or spa then there's not enough chlorine or it recently has been shocked (10+ PPM)!
The smell associated with chlorine is actually chloramine which is the used up chlorine and does nothing for sanitation purposes. I have had a pool now for 4 years and I have only have had the smell twice. Keeping up with the water chemistry is important.
I agree that it's really a personal decision and there are people who use and swear by bromine. There are
people who swear by Baquacil also - it's an alternative to both chlorine and bromine, although most people don't say good things about Baquacil
If you go to docs site - rhtubs - and look under the FAQ in his forum, there are excellent pieces by Vermonter and Northman about water care with chlorine - take a look. It may not apply to you as your using the tub more frequently than the "average" person.
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Backpains,
I agree its personal preference but I used Dichlor from the start. I have not smelled chlorine or had any discomfort yet. My water crystal clear and no foam.
The only problem I have had on two different occasions was a yellowish scum line around the water line. My PH was high and after adjusting that it went away. Well I scrubbed it first but it never reappeared. The book said a High PH could cause staining.
Also I HIGHLY recommend the Taylor testing kit in place of test strips.
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Also I HIGHLY recommend the Taylor testing kit in place of test strips.
Lips that touch test strips will never touch mine!
No, that isn't quite right, but I haven't had any test strips in a year :)
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Ok I'll bite..what's the diff between test strips and the taylor test thing? Checked the tub this morning guess what??? Bromine is super!! All my levels looks great so, I guess adding some more tablets to the feeder helped, as far as the scummy line, I think we've figured it out....hubby needs to shower before he gets into MY hot tub lol!!! Everything else looks good, I do however need to grab a couple of the prefilters from my dealer soon.
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Lips that touch test strips will never touch mine!
No, that isn't quite right, but I haven't had any test strips in a year :)
OK, two things here:
1. While I thoroughly enjoy your work here as moderator and general all-around nice guy who supports hot tubbing as a rule, and I would gladly go out for hot wings any time we find ourselves on the same edge of the country, I am perfectly happy not having my lips ever touch yours. Ever. Come to think of it, I don't know why I would want my lips to touch a test strip... ;D
2. I have used test strips on spas for many years with no problems. They may not be as accurate as a liguid reagent test kit, and they most certainly are not as accurate as a tablet reagent kit - they have always worked fine for me. I really try to keep spa care as simple as I can for myself and my customers.
I will admit that I have some customers who really like the reagent test kits better, and I gladly keep them supplied. There are folks who have a touch of color-blindness and one type of tester works better than the other, but I generally set people up on test strips.
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Ditto on Chas. I use test strips and also get my water tested every few weeks since strips don't test for hardness, or TDS. I usually test with a strip right when I fill the test water bottle so I can see how my strips compare to the liquid reagent test at the dealer. The results from the strips always match the results from the liquid test for bromine, ph and TA. Strips work just fine and are a lot simpler.
txwillie
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OK, here's a question from a newbie!
How do you test the spa water at night to compare colors from a tester? I'm familiar with water testing as I've had a pool for 4 years now, but they tell you to use indirect light to test and use outdoor lighting.
Am I being stupid with this and just test it using incandesent indoor lighting?
Thanks!
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I have fairly good sight when it comes to color, but especially when it comes to ph, I can take a test strip and if I stare at it long enough, it can read anywhere from 7.0 to 7.8 for example, and if I do it twice with the same water and two strips, I'll get two readings everytime. Alk tests are almost as bad, I bought TDS strips once and I couldn't decide if it read 500 or 3000. They seem to read chlorine levels ok, but thats it for me.
PS, the slogan came from a girl I liked in the 7th grade named Rhonda. She use to wear a shirt that said, Lips that touch liquor, will never touch mine. FYI- worthless info of the week!
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Am I being stupid with this and just test it using incandesent indoor lighting?
Thanks!
Here is your assigment for the weekend :D At noon on a sunny day, take a reading out near the spa, decide on what it is, walk quickly into the house, look at it again, would you judge the same reading?
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the strips develop over time. you gotta read them at 15 seconds each time. if you read one at 10 and one at 20, they won't be the same. regarding indoor vs outdoor light, I guess I don't understand what you mean. You compare the strips to color charts on the bottle, both of which are in the same light. They probably do look different outdoors vs inddors, but the comparison will be the same.
txwillie
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While this is true, Chlorine is less likely to raise your pH than Bromine. So its a good thing it is still 80% effective since you are much more likely to have high pH.
How would something with a ph of around 4 raise ph??
While it isn't as acidic as chlorine, it certainly is still acidic!!
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How would something with a ph of around 4 raise ph??
While it isn't as acidic as chlorine, it certainly is still acidic!!
Good question. I am not going to BS you, I do not have the chemistry background to answer it.
I can tell you that representatives from BioGuard, Beachcomber Plus, Lawrasons and Mursatt (all chemical suppliers) have told me this.
Perhaps my observations are skewed, but everything that I have observed in the tens of thousands of water tests I have done would support this claim.
From my understanding, it is not the introduction of the puck itself that raises the pH, but how bromine exists in the water that allows pH creep more than bromine.
Perhaps one of my colleagues here has a scientific explaination to support my statement.
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Your chemical reps are either ignorant to the facts of misleading you. I would guess it's the latter. I think what they should be saying is that bromine doesn't bring ph down as effectively as chlorine (it DOESN'T raise ph). Ph tends to rise in a spa because the combined effects of aeration and heat causes CO2 to off-gas. CO2 in your water allows for the formation of carbonic acid, which holds your ph down.
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Your chemical reps are either ignorant to the facts of misleading you. I would guess it's the latter.
I will assume that you meant to say "...the facts or misleading you......"
If that is what you meant, I wonder how you came to the the conclusion that they were misleading me intentionally. They certainly weren't pushing one over the other. They were explaining the differences.
May I ask what you qualifications are to make such a bold conclusion?
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I did indeed mean "or"....good catch. I didn't mean to imply that they were misleading you to promote one over the other, or that they even know they are misleading you. But to tell someone(who shouldn't be as well versed as they on chemicals) that Hypobromous ACID will raise ph is misleading. As far as my qualifications, the dealer that I work for will not allow any employee to interact with a customer until they are proficient in water testing, chemical knowledge, and the practical marriage of the two. So you know, the majority of our information comes from Bioguard, which is why I was suprised your Bioguard rep would tell you such a thing. See if your rep can find you a copy of thier Bioguard ChemPlus 2000 training manual. It's quite comprehensive and could become an invaluable tool for you to help better serve your customers. The goal for all dealers should be to supply the facts to thier customers (warts and all) and let them make an informed decision. I'm sure you have nothing but honorable intentions when passing information along to your customers, that's why I through your reps under the proverbial bus. ;D
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Here is your assigment for the weekend :D At noon on a sunny day, take a reading out near the spa, decide on what it is, walk quickly into the house, look at it again, would you judge the same reading?
OK Bill, I did my homework even though it is a 3 day weekend and YES it's the same reading. Now should I shut my eyes to simulate night time? ... Keeping with me being stupid theme! ;D
You know, of ALL the tests that I've done on my pool I NEVER thought of bringing it indoors to see!
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Hubby and I have no problems reading the test strips...it's pretty clear how to read them I guess unless your a little color blind it would be a little hard.....as far as testing the water at night we keep a flashlight out in the spa room to read it just in case. I've noticed that it seems the Bromine is starting to catch up to my "unhealthy" use of the tub (lol just kidding I do use it more than the "average" person that's a true statement) you guys probably use your tubs maybe 1-2 times a day, where as I am using mine 5-6 times a day, if I start hurting I head for the hot tub, along with my regimen of meds it usually takes a little bit of the edge off.
Anyway, it seems to be getting better.
Backpains
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Are you getting more comfortable with adding the appropriate amount of chemicals in the spa Backpains? I hope the spa is providing some relief for your back as well. Good luck and enjoy your new spa!!
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Are you getting more comfortable with adding the appropriate amount of chemicals in the spa Backpains? I hope the spa is providing some relief for your back as well. Good luck and enjoy your new spa!!
Oh yeah it's not that hard, however I have to go to Billings sometime soon to get some more bromine concentrate and some more test strips. We are also getting some enzyme tablets to add as I'm in the tub alot
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6 to 7 times a day, NOW thats what I call living the good life 8)
You are going to grow scales soon!
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6 to 7 times a day, NOW thats what I call living the good life 8)
You are going to grow scales soon!
Not growing scales maybe fins and some gills would be good LOLOLOL.