Hot Tub Forum
Original => Hot Tub Forum => Topic started by: MrLobster on July 31, 2015, 08:32:54 am
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Hi All,
After many weeks of waiting our new Artesian Antigua is here and ready to use. Still playing with getting the water balance right, using info I've pulled together about Ozone and Nature2 systems, but I've a feeling they aren't quite what I need based on the Crystal AOP system treating the ozone with UV before it reaches the rest of the spa.
A search of the forum hasn't turned up much info, I'm hoping that's because I'm searching for the wrong thing and there's a generic name I should look for instead. Anyone able to point me in the right direction?
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The Crystal AOP is a unique system only found in Artesian spas. Basically, you just need to keep around 1 ppm of chlorine or bromine in the spa and shock it every 1 to 2 weeks depending upon bather load. I personally would get a bromine floater and some tablets, stick it in the filter area and leave it on a very low setting. You shouldn't be able to even notice 1 ppm of bromine in the water.
Congrats on the purchase. That is a really great spa!
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Thanks for the info Sam, that sounds like a really simple plan. Would it make much difference if I went with chlorine in the floater instead? The starter kit chemicals were all chlorine, so that's what's in the water at the moment. I think I'd need a water change to switch to bromine?
I'm thinking a small pack of chlorine tablets, then switch to bromine at the next water change.
Really loving the spa, we've been in every day since it arrived. So glad we went with a good brand rather than one of the cheap imports that are very common over here in England.
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Chlorine in tablet form is different than chlorine in granular form. It is very low in ph and can cause water balance issues. It also tends to dissolve too fast in hot water. It is typically only used in pools.
Also, you do not need to do a complete water change. You can start using bromine tablets at any time. Keep the chlorine on hand to use as a shock.
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Great info again, very much appreciated. Tablets and a dispenser have been ordered, and it's good to know I'll still be able to use the starter kit chemicals.
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I also have an Antigua with Crystal AOP, purchased last October (and love it). My dealer set me up to use Leisure Time chemicals, including Replenish as the chlorine shock. I just put a couple of ounces in when I first fill the tub and get it warm (along with adding Calcium Booster and a little Spa Up to raise the pH). After that, I just add an ounce or two after using the tub, and that's about it. I find that once I get the water balanced, it stays pretty well balanced, even if we are using the tub heavily. I will have to occasionally add just a little Spa Up, and I don't think I've even opened the container of Spa Down. Check it with a test strip once a week, change the water and Nature2 stick every 4 months, and our water stays pretty darn clean.
I am not a chemical expert by any means, but the Leisure Time chemical suite seems to be working well for me.
I hope you enjoy your Antigua as much as we enjoy ours!
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Thanks for the info ksugrad, always good to know the options out there.
At the moment I'm using the floating bromine dispenser, going well although I did have the levels bouncing all over for a day or two. Adding some alkalinity increaser sorted that out.
The Antigua is great, we're spending an hour in there most days, but the time does go by quickly.
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I know this is an old topic, but does this spa not come with a Frog @Ease system?
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Yea if they are using bromine they should be using a frog system. N2 works with chlorine.
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@ease is pretty new and may not have been available when this thread originated. @ease can only come on Marquis, Caldera and Artesian Spas as a built-in delivery system, but they also have a floating aftermarket option that will work with any system.
@ease has a lot of similar traits as the frog or nature II systems but it is different in that the mineralizer is different than what is found in the frog/NII sticks. Additionally, the chlorine used is completely brand new to the industry as a whole. I have been a big fan of NII/frog over bromine and/or chlorine but I will be switching to @ease as it costs the same as running an NII system but I've had tremendous feedback from diehard NII customers who I let try @ease for free to determine if it really was appealing or if it was just another salesman-y gimmick.
The Cyrstal AOP system is their version of a deluxe ozone. Ozone is not a substitute for your chemical sanitation system but rather an assistant to it.
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I also just purchased a brand new 2016 Pelican Bay with the Crystal AOP system. It seems like the @ease with smartchlor is so new there really is NO information about it on the web, so time will tell I guess.
I'm just finishing up with building permits and hope to have the spa delivered ASAP (it's sitting in the dealers warehouse right now.)
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To break it down in simplistic terms:
pH/alkalinity are the same, as they are in reference to chlorine, bromine, frog, nature II, etc.
Its very similar to spa frog where you have a 4 month cartridge and a 1 month cartridge. The 4 month cartridge has a slightly different mineral content that is formulated specifically for the "smartchlor" cartridge. What makes it "smartchlor" different (besides clever marketing) is that the chlorine is altogether different.
Di or Tri chlors have 2 atoms that split and immediately become free chlorine. This "smartchlor" allows for one atom to become free chlorine and the other stays in reserve. Thus, you tend to have a resting free chlorine reading of .5-1.0 (approx. the same as your tap water) but a reserve to total chlorine of 10-15ppm.
Where this becomes a benefit is that when you use the tub, the chlorine levels do not fall off a cliff. Rather it pulls from the free chlorine to keep a consistent level of approx. .5-1.0ppm. It handles heavy bather loads as well, since the free chlor can keep up with the burn up of the active sanitizer.
This allows for you to only have to shock with potassium peroxymonopersulfate (MPS) once a month. That is a nice benefit. However, it is also very much reflective of your pH level. While pH is always important to your sanitzier, as it is the the basis of how effective your sanitizer is is, its even more-so with @ease.
I have found that the cost (as a dealer, I am always looking at pricing) for a 4 month supply of @ease to be on par with NatureII/Spa frog. So I am comfortable with that angle.
I get presented a lot of chemicals that are "new" and "revolutionary" to carry in my store but in the end they are just some other BS that some salesperson/marketing dept. came up with. Kudos for ingenuity but I'm still not buying it. Why I am comfortable with this as the chlorine was tested for 6 years before it even was approved. Additionally, I have tried it on my tubs that are filled in my showroom and have had a positive experience.
I hope this helps you guys out. I have all of my South Seas/Artesian Spas coming in with the @ease systems built in. I've also brought in the @ease floaters for my other two lines of tubs so that they can use it after-market. The after-market @ease is a round floater that will tip upside down when the 1 month cartridge is spent, which is pretty handy.
Finally, @ease is actually made via King Technology, the parent company of Spa Frog. So if you have been using Spa Frog ask your rep/distributor.
Good luck moving forward.
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Thanks for the info! Yeah, my dealer told me a lot of the same things you're mentioning, so that makes me feel comfortable.
I couldn't tell if it were just a sales pitch or not, but he said it's so easy that it really is close to being automatic and takes a lot of the guess work out.
HOPEFULLY I'll see that in a few weeks!
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Hi All,
I've not been around for a few months, quite surprised to see an old thread of mine near the top of the page when I dropped by.
Do you know if the @ease system can be retro-fitted to an existing tub? I'm using bromine in a floater at the moment, and would really like to switch to something built in. I see that @ease can be used in a floater but would prefer to avoid that route.
Hope you have a great time with your spa htnj, I'm still very much enjoying my Antigua - even using it through the cold British winter
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@ease has its own floater for aftermarket sales. It is round, about 5" in diameter. Its not very cumbersome at all, in my opinion, and I float one in my showroom in my demo spa.
However, the in-line @ease that is so far only available on Artesian, Marquis, and Caldera is the same size as the Spa Frog systems that used to be put in-line in tubs about 10 years ago.
Here is how they look: http://www.kingtechnology.com/frog-at-ease/frog-ease-ways-sell/
Retrofitting in any other manner seems more hassle than its worth.
Good luck moving forward.
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Thanks for the info Wizard, I'll talk to the local Artesian dealer and see if he can fit the in-line version. I'm guessing it goes behind the access panel on the side of the tub? The Nature 2 cartridges fit inside one of the filters but @ease looks too large to work that way.
Cheers,
Mr Lobster
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Since my last post I've found some more info, dropping this here for anyone else interested. Looking at the manual, the Inline version is accessed from the top side of the spa so little chance it's available as a retro-fit.
Here's a page with links to the manual
http://www.kingtechnology.com/product/atease_in_line_system/
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Since my last post I've found some more info, dropping this here for anyone else interested. Looking at the manual, the Inline version is accessed from the top side of the spa so little chance it's available as a retro-fit.
Here's a page with links to the manual
http://www.kingtechnology.com/product/atease_in_line_system/
Yeah, the inline system looks pretty nice. It seems so convenient that I am mostly looking at tubs that have it.
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The in-line system is only offered on Artesian, Caldera and Marquis. If you do not have one that is ordered in that way, you have to go with the floater.
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The in-line system is only offered on Artesian, Caldera and Marquis. If you do not have one that is ordered in that way, you have to go with the floater.
Does the in-line system work better than a floater, or are they pretty much the same?
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Apples and Oranges: No option if you didn't order the aforementioned brand with the system built in. The cost will be approx the same but if I was offered I'd take it in-line. However, if I didn't have a new Artesian/Caldera/Marquis ordered with one, I'd still take the floater over a chlorine or bromine or Nature II system, and I sell all four types of sanitizers.
Note: "In-Line" means there is a chamber plumbed into the shell itself. This is not something that can be added post-sale. Thus, you will need the floater if you already have a hot tub. In-Line is only available for yet-to-be-ordered tubs from the three brands I mentioned.
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So got a question; my new Pelican Bay has the AOP system and I see the box when I take the cabinet panel off.
However, how do I check\replace the bulb?
I don't see anyway of opening that AOP box unless disassemble it completely.
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The whole thing must be replaced- There is no bulb to replace. Only downside to it.
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The whole thing must be replaced- There is no bulb to replace. Only downside to it.
Hmmm...when we bought it, the dealer said bulb life was like 20k hours (~ 3 years) and it's only a $40 part to replace. I guess the entire module is that price?
Is there any way to tell if it's functioning or not?
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The whole thing must be replaced- There is no bulb to replace. Only downside to it.
Hmmm...when we bought it, the dealer said bulb life was like 20k hours (~ 3 years) and it's only a $40 part to replace. I guess the entire module is that price?
Is there any way to tell if it's functioning or not?
just to clarify....If you have a UV ozone that requires a bulb typical lifespan on the bulbs is approx. 10-12 months...at that point it will need to be replaced at an approx. $40-$90 cost....the other style is Corona Discharge which will have an approx. lifespan of 2-4 years and at that point the entire unit will need to be replaced, you can get a good corona discharge ozonator online for approx. $149-$199 give or take...here is a site that explains the differences in technical form: http://www.ozoneapplications.com/info/cd_vs_uv.htm (http://www.ozoneapplications.com/info/cd_vs_uv.htm)
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AOP by Artesian does not have the ability to be changed out in parts. I asked the manufacturer and they said it had to be changed out completely. UV/Corona are your more basic types of ozone. AOP is a different type of ozonator.
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AOP by Artesian does not have the ability to be changed out in parts. I asked the manufacturer and they said it had to be changed out completely. UV/Corona are your more basic types of ozone. AOP is a different type of ozonator.
similar to Plasma? Dynasty uses a "plasma ozone" which I assume to be a "marketing spin" on a plain old ozone, maybe not though? I rarely sell ozone so I don't care enough to pay attention to all the new marketing terms
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Agreed. The AOP is like what Catalina Spas used to do with their old Mazzei ozonator- Has a long amount of plumbing so that 100% of the ozone is used prior to it evaporating at the surface. It is all self-contained though in one kit, as I have tried to get just parts from the factory, to no avail.
I do not push ozone either. I am not against it. But, like my feelings with filters, I know it is at best an assistant to your own personal management of the hot tub's water chemistry.
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I have a Caldara Geneva with the inline frog system. Last year I stared having problems with the bromine and figured out I was one of the people allergic to bromine. No one else had any issues at all and some used it more than I did my water always tested perfect. I got the bromine out and switched to diclor giving it a daily dose dependent on usage and it is working great. Around the first of the year they finally got the inline ease in stock and I’m about to try it. The main reason I want it is for when we go away for a couple weeks. Other than that I don’t mind hitting it once a day or every other day I think it’s a good idea to keep an eye on it.
One of the problems I had with the bromine was the level thru the inline feeder would change as the cartridge started getting used up. You also have this bromine bank and when you shock you get a huge spike. Might just be me but I had a heck of a time with bromine. Going to diclor by the spoon full after our soak and the next day a very low level when we are in is perfect for me. Plus its cheaper.
Anyone have any thoughts on just using the cartridge when you are away? I have left the minerals in all the time.
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You're kinda all over the place. If you are going to the @ease system, you do not shock, save for once a month. There are two cartridges (not unlike the Frog System): One that lasts 4 months, one that lasts 1 month. With @ease, pH and alkalinity balance are critical. pH/Alk is very important on any spa with any sanitation system. But as there is a reservoir of total chlorine of 10-15ppm but only 0.5-1.0ppm of free chlorine, the chemistry has to be good to maintain a steady sanitizer flow.
Additionally, this chlorine is completely different: It is not a DiChlor (I forget what the actual active ingredient is) but it is slow release. Also- The mineral cartridge is a different formula than what Spa Frog/Nature II is made of.
Thus- You have your cartridges in your in-line feeder, have your pH and alkalinity balanced, and you leave it alone. You check your pH and alkalinity regularly and replace the cartridges accordingly.
That is all.
Does that make sense? I hope it does. Good luck moving forward.
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You're kinda all over the place. If you are going to the @ease system, you do not shock, save for once a month. There are two cartridges (not unlike the Frog System): One that lasts 4 months, one that lasts 1 month. With @ease, pH and alkalinity balance are critical. pH/Alk is very important on any spa with any sanitation system. But as there is a reservoir of total chlorine of 10-15ppm but only 0.5-1.0ppm of free chlorine, the chemistry has to be good to maintain a steady sanitizer flow.
Additionally, this chlorine is completely different: It is not a DiChlor (I forget what the actual active ingredient is) but it is slow release. Also- The mineral cartridge is a different formula than what Spa Frog/Nature II is made of.
Thus- You have your cartridges in your in-line feeder, have your pH and alkalinity balanced, and you leave it alone. You check your pH and alkalinity regularly and replace the cartridges accordingly.
That is all.
Does that make sense? I hope it does. Good luck moving forward.
funny enough I have one sitting on my desk that a rep just dropped off as a sample...The SmartChlor Cartridge is listed as: 1,3 dichloro-5 81.1% and 1,3 dichloro-5 ethyl-5-methlhydantoin 16.1% and Other Ingredients 2.8%
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Alas- I need to better articulate: It is not traditional DiChlor, as it only releases one chlorine atom while the other atom goes in reserve. Hence- The 10-15ppm total chlorine reservoir. Your standard DiChlor that is up to 97% active will always release its two chlorine atoms, whereas the new chlorine with @ease is slow release.