Hot Tub Forum
Original => Hot Tub Forum => Topic started by: ezduzit on July 01, 2008, 09:42:04 pm
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First time posting. First time buying spa.
WANTED: 2008 Sundance Chelsee delivered with lift/cover, steps, chemicals/ozone
Local dealer quotes $7995 plus tax plus all the items on my wish list. Told him no can do. His Final offer is $7995 including the things I want. My family wet tested the Chelsee in his store and have also had him come out to quote our hut tub deck construction. He stands to profit from the deck job and any markup in the tub, but insists he "Will not sell the Chelsee, in this area any cheaper." Claims he sets the market because Sundance protects his market. When I told him I would call the next closest Sundance Dealer, he said they are not allowed to sell, and deliver a Sundance in another dealers market.
Poster on this sight claims they got a 2008 Chelsee in New York for $6250. My parents contacted a Sundance Dealer in Chicago where they live and they quoted $7000 the way I wanted it. Also, I have been told cover, oaozne and chemicals are standard stuff anyway. So, I KNOW he CAN sell this for less and still make a profit.
2 Questions:
1) Any other confirmed 2008 Chelsee Purchase Prices?
2) Is it true that one Sundance Dealer can not sell and deliver a tub in another dealers market? If true, is this legal? Why would the consumer not be able to buy what he wants where he wants and have the benefit of competition to keep prices fair?
Thanks for your thoughts.
EZ
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So you were expecting him to say "Sure, call the other Sundance dealers. In fact, here are their phone numbers." Laws differ from state to state and I am no attorney, but I wouldnt doubt that most spa manufacturers that view dealers as an investment instead of just a facilitator frown upon dealers crossing into other dealers territories.
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I am the one who purchased the sundance chelsea for 6250.. plus tax ,it came with everything including ozonator and delivery and set up,they started at 6700 I came down and settled at 6250.I was advised by a dealer I was getting a great deal,so I committed to the purchase.I still believe this excellent tub can be had for < 7000.My wife and kids love and it is built verywell. hang tough and check out other dealers,and yes my tub is a 2008 model!Regards marc
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;D ;D A dealer can chose to sell a product at any price they want. You can choose to buy it, or not.
It also not unusual for manufacturers (of many products) to give exclusive markets (locations) to their dealers. Especially in a small markets, such as spas, where manufacturers want to protect their dealers and assure they survive.
As I said before, it's your choice whether or not to buy (typically it's the competition of other brands that helps set the price).
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You can buy from any dealer you want. Call up one in Texas and have it shipped is just fine. The problem comes in when (or IF) you need service. I don't know what the legall details are of "forcing" your local dealer to honor an "in-warranty" claim for a tub you bought "out of market" but the bottom line is that you need to let that dealer know that his tub isn't your ONLY choice and you need to shop for a different brand. As you have seen, that dealer isn't willing to discount his price against his own manufacturer. Part of this is because he does have some protection. But if he learns that he could loose the sale to a close local competitor (i.e. A Jacuzzi dealer or a Marquis dealer just down the road) then he looses his "edge" of having the tub you want. In short, your negotiating skills need to chance to force him to be more competitive. If all else fails, vote with your wallet and BUY FROM SOMEONE ELSE!
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The contract the dealer has with the manufacturer is he will provide the warranty service for what he sells. The dealer can deliver anywhere, as long as he provides the service.
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First time posting. First time buying spa.
Welcome to the board. I hope you get all the info you are looking for, and buy the spa you want.
I KNOW he CAN sell this for less and still make a profit.
Actually, this sounds reasonable, but isn't. Unless you know what he pays for rent, staff, advertising, insurance, FUEL, gas and electric, phone, yellow pages, building maintenance, and so on, you can't possibly know if he is making a dime on this sale. The cost of my 7000 SF store/warehouse combo may be much more or much less per month than the guy down the street, or the guy in another city.
Thanks for your thoughts.
No charge...
EZ
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Thanks for all the replies. Some good points.
Obviously, I have a CHOICE to buy or not. I just wanted to have a better understanding of his position not to go any lower and claim that I couldn't get a Sundance any cheaper because his territory is protected and he can set the Sundance price for this market even if there are other dealers selling them for less in other places.
I have to assume buying from a dealer who will(can) service what he sells is pretty important. If he refuses to service his brand of tub unless he sold it to me then I am at the mercy of my local repair market to find someone else to service it. So, even if I pay less, it may be worth it in the long run to pay a premium to have buy it local from him. Even so, I think he needs to come down. So, I will have to convince him that I have other good choices other than Sundance and he may choose to be more flexible.
Thanks!
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I came across the same attitude and WORSE from my local Sundance dealer. I kept looking and found another tub that suits us perfectly. (TBD July 11) I was set on an Optima but the attitude of the dealer (and the reputation of support) was LOUSY. The dealer from HotSprings has been wonderful and helpful in all aspects of the purchase (discounts, accommodations etc.) We know we will get the after purchase support.
Keep looking and wettesting.. you'll find the right one at the right price
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I am the one who purchased the sundance chelsea for 6250.. plus tax ,it came with everything including ozonator and delivery and set up,they started at 6700 I came down and settled at 6250.I was advised by a dealer I was getting a great deal,so I committed to the purchase.I still believe this excellent tub can be had for < 7000.My wife and kids love and it is built verywell. hang tough and check out other dealers,and yes my tub is a 2008 model!Regards marc
Darth,
I realize you stated it included everything but, did that include stereo and coverlift as well?
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EZ--
I agree to keep looking and wet testing other brands, just to be certain. ANd, IMHO, the service AFTER the sale is EQUALLY important as the tub, equipment, etc.
When it is definately narrowed down, see what the Snobdance salespersan has to say then--it is your bucks you're spending. Not that the dealer doesn't deserve to make a profit...do they sell pools, too??
Chrisi
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My 2 cents...
In my recent experiences in looking I have found that
The dealers that have sales on aren't generally going to come down in price, they will add a few more extras in to make the sale.
If you mention you've narrowed it down to 2 or 3 tubs and are serious about it, this helps in negotiating as well.
There is the odd dealer that will come down in their price without the items I mentioned previously.
Paying cash instead of credit card helps as well.
Dave
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There was a lawsuit many moons ago about protected territories and the outcome was it was illegal. On the other hand all a manufacturer has to do is not set up more than one dealer in a particular region. For smaller market items (spas) that is one of the reason you will only see one dealer of said product in a town.
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Thanks for all the replies. Some good points.
Obviously, I have a CHOICE to buy or not. I just wanted to have a better understanding of his position not to go any lower and claim that I couldn't get a Sundance any cheaper because his territory is protected and he can set the Sundance price for this market even if there are other dealers selling them for less in other places.
I have to assume buying from a dealer who will(can) service what he sells is pretty important. If he refuses to service his brand of tub unless he sold it to me then I am at the mercy of my local repair market to find someone else to service it. So, even if I pay less, it may be worth it in the long run to pay a premium to have buy it local from him. Even so, I think he needs to come down. So, I will have to convince him that I have other good choices other than Sundance and he may choose to be more flexible.
Thanks!
If you want a Sundance he's your man and he knows it. Personally, I'd let him know that while he may have the market cornered on Sundance he doesn't control Hot Spring, Marquis, D1, etc. and that since you feel that he isn't being flexible you feel a need to see what other options you have out there. I wonder if that will stir up his desire to sell you at a price you feel has been bargained a bit. In fact, if it were me I know I would look at the others and know my options and then go back to see his spa again. I'd politely and in straight forward manner say "it’s down to the Chelsee and the XXXX spa that I've since looked at and I wanted to see if that was still your final offer.
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Skelman.my price did not include stereo ,and yes It came with the cover lifter.regards marc
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If you want a Sundance he's your man and he knows it. Personally, I'd let him know that while he may have the market cornered on Sundance he doesn't control Hot Spring, Marquis, D1, etc. and that since you feel that he isn't being flexible you feel a need to see what other options you have out there. I wonder if that will stir up his desire to sell you at a price you feel has been bargained a bit. In fact, if it were me I know I would look at the others and know my options and then go back to see his spa again. I'd politely and in straight forward manner say "it’s down to the Chelsee and the XXXX spa that I've since looked at and I wanted to see if that was still your final offer.
Excellent advice, when you do shop around you may find the Chelsea isn't THE spa for you.
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..."Will not sell the Chelsee, in this area any cheaper." Claims he sets the market because Sundance protects his market. When I told him I would call the next closest Sundance Dealer, he said they are not allowed to sell, and deliver a Sundance in another dealers market.
This, too, was my experience 4 years ago when I was hunting. I even called the 2 next closest Sundance dealers...150 mi. east and 150 mi. west...and both refused to quote me. I ended up buying my LSX from the closest MasterSpas dealer at the time (250 mi. away) and, though I'm sure I would have been happy with the Cameo I was trying to buy, I am VERY glad I made the choice I did...a much better choice for me. Forget about the SD and look elsewhere.
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On Sundance spas web site they are again offering 12 months, 0% financing no payment no interest for a full year sponsered by ge money bank.Definitely consider this to help reduce the initial outlay of cash.I did and you can apply on line and get approval and the amountof credit they will approve in advance,best of luck .Happy hottubing ! Marc Ps.the dates are from June 28 till July 13,2008 .
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Fair Trade Act prohibits manufacturers from limiting territory restraints, however we do all play by the good guy rules and stay in our own areas as we do have to service what we sell.
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As I said before, it's your choice whether or not to buy (typically it's the competition of other brands that helps set the price).
Spa Medicine man speaks great wisdom. I rarely give price advice as far as specific numbers go. However, from what little I read, he may know you have settled on that model and there is little incentive. When I bought 5 years ago, almost every dealer in town saw me multiple times. (except the Master spa dealer at the time who torqued me off via email) It never hurts to carry competing brand literature with you. I had my notebook.
It was on my third visit to my dealer that the price shook loose. All this said, I have no idea of the value of the price in this particular case.