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91
Hot Tub Forum / Re: Order new tub With Circulation pump -or- Without? Why or Why Not?
« Last post by cranbiz on December 24, 2023, 08:59:18 am »
I'm in the have a circulation pump corner. The idea of running my main pump just to move water around when not in use just doesn't make sense to me if you can equip a tub with a small pump to do that.

Why BullFrog only offers them as an option, I don't know. It was a consideration when I bought my tub.
92
Probably 40 years ago I had a 4 person tub in what would be a deep blue and black pattern. What @BullFrogSpaNMN said is very true on the ability to vacuum and clean out debris. It was very dark inside the tub also.

My current tub is a Tuscan Sun acrylic. Lighter brown with gold orange, etc. It's not too dark in it and it's easy to see in it for maintenance. Personally. I liked this pattern and color palate over a white (to bathtub looking to me). I wouldn't buy a dark color, I agree to keep it on the lighter side of things but wouldn't shy away from a lighter shade of brown like a Tuscan Sun.
93
My only issue with these roadshows is warranty service. You are essentially buying direct or if not direct, from a dealer who is not local to your area (see Masterspa)

Finding someone who can and will do warranty service on your roadshow tub might be an issue. You will want to thoroughly research this prior to buying.
94
Little bit of advice...I would go in and find a spa that you and are interested in purchasing before worrying about negotiating between dealers, there could be other factors in the price gap, for example some dealers will price in long term financing (36/48/60 months @ 0%) which will cost the dealer between $1,500-$2,500 on average) so they have to cover those costs or some dealers just prefer to start higher than others which will allow for more of a discount.  Some dealers price in delivery + setup, some don't, some price in a high end step and a nice cover lifter, some include the cheapest lifter and steps available, etc. etc.

Once you find the spa you like, let both know you are prepared to buy and you'll find out their best price when your checkbook is in your hand regardless of posted or advertised prices.  Also buying from a newer dealers shouldn't be a deal breaker but I would check into how they are setup for servicing that spa, do they have in-house experienced technicians for example would be a great question to ask.

Also, just FYI the A9L has 7 jetpaks/3 pumps/circulation pump is optional, go in and test that bad boy, I'm sure you will love the jetting as it's incredible on all the Bullfrog A/M Series models and you almost have to go 'Select' which gives you the ability to pick from the 4 upgraded exteriors which are some of the best looking cabinets in the industry and the price gap between a 'Plus' and a 'Select' isn't really all that much relatively speaking to the cost of the spa...Good Luck!
95
Hot Tub Forum / Re: Buying a tub at a 20% to 35% savings from a brand new dealer?
« Last post by Davekro on December 23, 2023, 01:55:02 pm »
Anyone experience their dealer going out of business before the selling dealer's obligated to Bullfrog Parts, Plumbing & Labor 5-year warranty?
1) What would be Bullfrog or any other manufacturer's solution in this case?
2) What might be another local dealer's attitude or willingness to fulfill the last few years of a tubs Parts, Plumbing & Labor 5-year factory warranty?
3) Do dealer's bill the manufacturer for replacement parts -and- labor hours?
4) Or, do selling dealers just bill the factory for Parts and absorb the Labor Cost due to their sale of the tub and agreement with the manufacturer as a condition of carrying their line?
5) If #4 is the case, would another local dealer probably be willing to service your tub under warranty for Parts only, and they'd need to charge you for labor?
6) If #% were the case, after paying labor for a diagnostic service call, what are the chances of the manufacturer supplying parts directly to the customer to install himself?
7) Or leaving a dealer out of it, would Bullfrog send replacement parts to a customer directly? If so, I wonder what kind of proof of failure Bullfrog might require? Or would Bullfrog only cover parts that: a) a Bullfrog dealer's service tech said was required,  b) any independent spa service tech said was required?

Thanks, Dave
96
Hot Tub Forum / Buying a tub at a 20% to 35% savings from a brand new dealer?
« Last post by Davekro on December 22, 2023, 10:36:21 pm »
I read here that buying from a reputable dealer with an established history is pretty important. Some have said that the dealer is as important as the spa's quality. That may be coming from dealers on this forum. Please know that I am in no way diss'ing the many valuable forum members who are dealers. They contribute a wealth of knowledge and seem to be very respectful not to dump on different brands. That is a gift all it's own! Heck, I'd be saying it if I was an established spa dealer.  ;)

I ask because I have been quoted pricing on the Bullfrog A6L & A7L, all three trim levels, by a brand-new spa dealer which are very significantly lower than the largest dealer in my area with many stores. ≈ 28% lower on the two spas for the Standard Trim. ≈ 19% lower for the two spas for the Plus Trim. ≈ 20% lower for the two spas for the Select Trim. That's between a $3,000 to $5,000 difference from the large dealer's website posted prices.
The new dealer has two stores. The one that is an hour away has sold spas for 9 months. The store that I am talking to, 30 minutes away, has been open for 2 months. This new store also sells fireplaces. They have been in the fireplace business for 8–9 years and just added spas. This store has 13 spas on display, eight of them are Bullfrogs (A5L, A6L, A6, A7, A7D, A9L which is filled for wet tests, M8). That is way more than the larger dealer, because he also sells Sundance, which I believe is their primary over Bullfrog. I will be going to their store between Christmas and new year's with my wife to wet test all the JetPaks in the A9L, which has 8 JetPaks and 3 Jet Pumps.

Granted, I have not called the large dealer back and asked if they would price match the new store in the area. I would certainly do that when I get closer to settling on the specific model and Trim Level.

Assuming, for the sake of discussion, that the larger dealer would drop their price ≈ 1/3 of the new dealer's discounted amount. What dollar amount or percentage of price discount would you pay above the low price offer, to get the more experienced dealer? A dealer is obligated to Bullfrog Parts, Plumbing & Labor 5-year warranty.

To save $2,000 - $3,000 on the purchase price, I think I might lean on Bullfrog's reputation for quality and think there might not be any significant problems in that 5 year time frame. If it means saving $5,000 or 30%, I would definitely roll the dice for that amount of money personally.

So bottom line, what is the dollar or % amount you'd pay extra for a perceived, potential more experience service team for your five-year warranty. I am assuming the larger Bullfrog dealer's service dept would not deny servicing my Bullfrog tub out of warranty, when they are billing for parts and labor. Correct me if I am mistaken on this.

Thanks for any input from this knowledgeable community!
Dave
PS. Although it may seem like I am spamming the forum with Davekro posts, I am just very excited to learn as much as possible quickly so I can make a well-informed hot tub purchase decision. OK, and maybe somewhat OCD. LOL  ;)
I am glad this community is here. I hope I am not annoying forum members with too many post/ questions. I will definitely post back what I learn here on the forum about my questions and other posts that I have some knowledge to share. I do believe posting back info... But that may become TMI also. Oye  ::)
97
Hot Tub Forum / Re: Order new tub With Circulation pump -or- Without? Why or Why Not?
« Last post by Davekro on December 22, 2023, 09:32:02 pm »
I think this topic would be very good to have a write-up on in the

Hot Tub Buying Guide

Just my 2 cents.  :)
98
Hot Tub Forum / Order new tub With Circulation pump -or- Without? Why or Why Not?
« Last post by Davekro on December 22, 2023, 09:26:06 pm »
Circulation Pump or NO circulation Pump, that is the question.

In my search of this site I did not find a thread that discussed the Pros and Cons if you should order your hot tub with or without a Circulation Pump, assuming your tub has an ozone generator which I'd assume needs to run for longer periods than just two or three 2-hour cleaning sessions per day. I may be wrong. I want to learn basically: 1) How many hours per day a low speed Jet pump should run on average for effective cleaning. 2) If there is no Circ. pump, ≈ how many hours per day should the Jet pump (lower rpm of course) to take advantage of the ozone generator to get enough ozone into the water to be effective at its job?

Why are Circ. Pumps NOT in ANY Bullfrog spas, any Trim Level, only offered as Optional? I may be buying -or- ordering a new Bullfrog A6L or A7L. Am I wrong to think it would be an important thing to add? Why or why not?

I am new to the modern hot tubs, but it would seem they would include a Circ. pump in at least their Plus or Select trim levels. They are not that expensive to add. Bullfrog must feel they really add marginal value, or even have a downside??

One dealer I spoke to said they have their wet floor model A9L set to run every 30 mins. I don't recall for how long. It makes sense that for the ozone generator to be of much use, it has to run more than say 2 hours twice a day. I wonder for how long and how many times per day the default Bullfrog software runs one of the Jet pumps on the low pressure to circulate for cleaning and infusing ozone into the water?
99
Bullfrog Spas / Does your Bullfrog lighting package feel like it is undewhelming?
« Last post by Davekro on December 22, 2023, 12:14:58 am »
The fellow in this YouTube video did not say which Trim Level of A7 he was reviewing, but I'm pretty sure it was the 'Plus Trim' because it had a 3-tiered water fall, but the cabinet was not 2-tone (Select).  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p5xiiQMEqgE

He felt his lighting ('Premium Lighting' I assume) was underwhelming compared to the rest of the great A7 Bullfrog features. He LOVED his A7. He was just a little disappointed in the lighting feature, but in balance said it was a small thing overall.

I'd be curious to hear what Trim level, and hence Std. vs. Premium lighting package you have and what you think of it. I'm told that the 'Select' Trim comes with (2) LED's under each headrest. Very Cool, but I doubt I'll spring an extra ≈$2500 (A6) or ≈$4300 (A7) over the base 'Standard Trim' for the extra LED's, Tungsten Bezels, Adjustable Headrests, and maybe a few extra LED's under the 3-tier water fall (??). All nice things, but not for those premiums for my wallet. YW(wallet)MV.  ;)

Thanks for any input on Bullfrog lighting.
Dave
100
Bullfrog Spas / Bullfrog Standard Headrests vs. Premium Headrests
« Last post by Davekro on December 21, 2023, 11:58:11 pm »
Can anyone describe the difference between 'Standard (Trim) Headrest', and the other two higher Trim's 'Premium Headrests'? I'm told that Std HR's are soft, so you cannot sit on them and have your legs dangle into the tub. ??? The Premium HR's are said to be hard (and wider), so you can sit on them. Curious if you can speak to your knowledge of the two headrest types?

Thank You,
Dave
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