Hot Tub Forum

Original => Hot Tub Forum => Topic started by: sandiego on May 01, 2006, 01:48:57 pm

Title: Sundance Filters
Post by: sandiego on May 01, 2006, 01:48:57 pm
There has been some discussion about the Sundacne filters in my market, and I wanted to see if I could get some straight information from some of you.

What is the cost for replacement of their new filter? Isn't it $90 or something like that? And how often are you supposed to replace it? I've heard that they are telling people it's every 12 months. Is that true?
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: luvin_tubin_sqezin on May 01, 2006, 01:54:03 pm
Quote
There has been some discussion about the Sundacne filters in my market, and I wanted to see if I could get some straight information from some of you.

What is the cost for replacement of their new filter? Isn't it $90 or something like that? And how often are you supposed to replace it? I've heard that they are telling people it's every 4 months. Is that true?


My dealer (sundance bahia 05) said the filters should last a year if correct maintenance is done on them and the water.  

The cost???  I'm trying to find that out now (see previous post!..can't seem to find the correct replacement filter).
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: Brewman on May 01, 2006, 03:39:13 pm
I'm assuming that SanDiego is asking about the new Sundance microfilter- the one that is disposable, not a standard, re-usable pleated filter.   I think the call it Microclean II.  If that's the one, I've heard that they're supposed to go up to a year.  But I've seen posts that indicate they may not last quite that long.
And yes, they cost about $90.  

My 2003 spa uses their dual filter- a standard pleated filter with an attached smaller microfilter.  This microfilter is about $15, and is supposed to be replaced 3 or 4 times per year.  Is this the filter you might be thinking of that gets replace each 90 days?

Some people just do away with those, and put in an equivalent sized standard pleated filter.  
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: Skellman on May 01, 2006, 03:50:29 pm
In my research of a 06' Optima, the dealer told me that the filters don't even need to be cleaned. :o
And they would last at least 1 year.
Am I being gullible in believing that?
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: hymbaw on May 01, 2006, 04:03:36 pm
SanDiego,
We have had customers averaging about 10 - 11 months on the MicroClean II. The MicroClean II is one piece blue filter ($100 here at my store).

Brewman has the MicroClean I, which is the 2 piece system.

Luvin,
You have neither, if you have an '05 Bahia you have the 125 sq. ft. pleated filter. If cleaned every 4 - 6 weeks it should last a couple of years or more.

Skellman,
You are not gullible for believing that, 'cause it's true!!
It's not that they don't have to be cleaned, it's that you can't clean them. A traditional filter is "surface loading" so you can clean the surface. The MicroClean is "depth loading" (the particulants are trapped inside the filter) so cleaning the surface will do you little good.

Hope I helped.
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: sandiego on May 01, 2006, 04:12:02 pm
Quote
SanDiego,
We have had customers averaging about 10 - 11 months on the MicroClean II. The MicroClean II is one piece blue filter ($100 here at my store).

Brewman has the MicroClean I, which is the 2 piece system.

Luvin,
You have neither, if you have an '05 Bahia you have the 125 sq. ft. pleated filter. If cleaned every 4 - 6 weeks it should last a couple of years or more.

Skellman,
You are not gullible for believing that, 'cause it's true!!
It's not that they don't have to be cleaned, it's that you can't clean them. A traditional filter is "surface loading" so you can clean the surface. The MicroClean is "depth loading" (the particulants are trapped inside the filter) so cleaning the surface will do you little good.

Hope I helped.


Thanks for the info, I was referring to the new microclean II filters.

$100 a year sounds awful expense though, when you get typically get a good 3 years out of a regular filter.

Do you use Baqua in your spas? Because I've also heard that those will clog the filters up much faster...
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: hymbaw on May 01, 2006, 04:35:12 pm
The 125 sq. ft. pleated filters Sundance used before the MicroClean system run about $80 (if you buy 2 so you can rotate them, $160), plus filter cleaner degreaser, plus another thing on your "to do" list, plus time time and hassle (what's your time worth?) I like the idea of just tossing your filter out when it's time. But that's just me.

AND....................Filters down to 5 micron particle as opposed to a 30 micron particle in a traditional filter. So CLEANER WATER ;D ;D

I don't use, sell, or generally like biguinide systems so I can't comment on how they work out with the MicroClean system.
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: sandiego on May 01, 2006, 05:12:32 pm
Quote
The 125 sq. ft. pleated filters Sundance used before the MicroClean system run about $80 (if you buy 2 so you can rotate them, $160), plus filter cleaner degreaser, plus another thing on your "to do" list, plus time time and hassle (what's your time worth?) I like the idea of just tossing your filter out when it's time. But that's just me.

AND....................Filters down to 5 micron particle as opposed to a 30 micron particle in a traditional filter. So CLEANER WATER ;D ;D

I don't use, sell, or generally like biguinide systems so I can't comment on how they work out with the MicroClean system.


Thanks for the info....
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: Spatech_tuo on May 01, 2006, 05:23:53 pm
Quote

Thanks for the info, I was referring to the new microclean II filters.

$100 a year sounds awful expense though, when you get typically get a good 3 years out of a regular filter.

Do you use Baqua in your spas? Because I've also heard that those will clog the filters up much faster...


I'm with you on that. Unfortunately we're in a "throw away society" where companies are always coming up with disposable products like that is some kind of improvement (these may filter fine, I just have an issue with the "throw away and buy a new one" part of this equation). I know persoanlly I'd have a hard time justifying to myself that I need to get a new $90 filter every 6 to 12 months.

I wonder if you choose to not replace the microclean II filter and just let the regular filter do the work?
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: hymbaw on May 01, 2006, 05:55:32 pm
Quote
I wonder if you choose to not replace the microclean II filter and just let the regular filter do the work?


The MicroClean II is the ONLY filter on the 880 series tubs.
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: alwaysperky on May 01, 2006, 08:05:00 pm
Hi Sandiego,

I got my Optima last August and the MC II filter lasted me about 6 months.  I use Baqua.  I paid about $90 bucks.

Though hymba stated the MCII is the ONLY filter, I thought I read somewhere that there was an alternative.  Can anyone else confirm?

Good Luck!

AP
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: Spatech_tuo on May 01, 2006, 09:12:52 pm
Quote
Though hymba stated the MCII is the ONLY filter, I thought I read somewhere that there was an alternative.  Can anyone else confirm?



I also thought there was an alternative standard filter you could substitue for those who aren't thrilled with having to get a new $90 one every 6 months.
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: Brewman on May 01, 2006, 10:21:49 pm
 I'm not sure that those filter are all that much more expensive than what I'm doing with my spa, which has the first generation microfilters.  

I spend $60 per year on the throw away microfilters.
Plus another $30 or so on filter cleaner.  There's $90 right there, plus the cost of making several trips per year to my spa dealer to pick them up- call it $12 for gas for the 4 trips.  
Add in the amortized cost of the pleated filter- those cost about $60 and last maybe 3 years, so it averages out to $20 per year.  

So I can say I spend maybe $120 per year on filter stuff.
If you can get 9 months out of one of those $90 Microclean II filters, it's about the same as I'm paying.
And you eliminate the hassle of cleaning the filters.

Of course swapping to just a pleated filter would be cheaper than either of those options.  

And a pleated filter is available for both systems to eliminate the toss out filters.

Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: alwaysperky on May 01, 2006, 11:01:57 pm
How big is 5 microns anyway?
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: Gomboman on May 01, 2006, 11:47:31 pm
I don't want to start a flame war here but I agree with spatech. I wanted a Sundace Optima but didn't like the idea of throwing away a $100 filter. I guess there's always compromises in life. I have to clean five Tri-X filters in my HS spa. For some that may be a downside, but for me it hasn't been an issue yet. By the way, what micron level are the Tri-X filters rated at?


Quote

I'm with you on that. Unfortunately we're in a "throw away society" where companies are always coming up with disposable products like that is some kind of improvement (these may filter fine, I just have an issue with the "throw away and buy a new one" part of this equation). I know persoanlly I'd have a hard time justifying to myself that I need to get a new $90 filter every 6 to 12 months.

I wonder if you choose to not replace the microclean II filter and just let the regular filter do the work?

Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: luvin_tubin_sqezin on May 02, 2006, 07:35:44 am
Quote
How big is 5 microns anyway?


Approximately half the thickness of a human hair.  
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: luvin_tubin_sqezin on May 02, 2006, 07:37:50 am
Quote
SanDiego,
We have had customers averaging about 10 - 11 months on the MicroClean II. The MicroClean II is one piece blue filter ($100 here at my store).

Brewman has the MicroClean I, which is the 2 piece system.

Luvin,
You have neither, if you have an '05 Bahia you have the 125 sq. ft. pleated filter. If cleaned every 4 - 6 weeks it should last a couple of years or more.

Skellman,
You are not gullible for believing that, 'cause it's true!!
It's not that they don't have to be cleaned, it's that you can't clean them. A traditional filter is "surface loading" so you can clean the surface. The MicroClean is "depth loading" (the particulants are trapped inside the filter) so cleaning the surface will do you little good.

Hope I helped.


I echo the thanks.  Good info.  I do realize what filter I have but my issue is that on at least 4 web sites, the filter they show for my tub ISN'T the one that's in there now, even docs site.  Not sure why no one can get it right????  
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: Spatech_tuo on May 02, 2006, 02:38:03 pm
Quote
I don't want to start a flame war here but I agree with spatech. I wanted a Sundace Optima but didn't like the idea of throwing away a $100 filter. I guess there's always compromises in life. I have to clean five Tri-X filters in my HS spa. For some that may be a downside, but for me it hasn't been an issue yet. By the way, what micron level are the Tri-X filters rated at?

There is no right and wrong here. Some would prefer the disposable for it's ease of use and if that's the case and they don't mind the cost, more power to them. I'd just prefer to clean and reuse rather than toss away, plus I'm a coupon clipping type of guy so it would be a double whammy for me.

With a regular filter you should have no issue getting 2½ years use from your filter with a replacement cost of about $50. Over that same time frame you'd spend about $300 on disposable filters (assuming they last about 9 months at $90 per filter). I certainly can see both sides so this certainly isn't a case of which way is best but rather which way each person prefers.
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: tony on May 02, 2006, 04:20:53 pm
Quote
I don't want to start a flame war here but I agree with spatech. I wanted a Sundace Optima but didn't like the idea of throwing away a $100 filter. I guess there's always compromises in life.



You don't have to use the Microclean II filter.  You could always use a conventional pleated filter and clean it.
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: Spatech_tuo on May 02, 2006, 04:35:26 pm
Quote

You don't have to use the Microclean II filter.  You could always use a conventional pleated filter and clean it.


Very good, that's what I was wondering.
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: Gomboman on May 02, 2006, 08:48:42 pm
A Tri-X filter can filter down to how many microns?
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: Gomboman on May 09, 2006, 12:28:50 am
Quote
A Tri-X filter can filter down to how many microns?


Does anyone know the answer to this?
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: Ronnie526 on May 09, 2006, 06:29:16 am
SpaTech .... I have an '05 Optima.  It came with the blue Microclean(?) filter.  My dealer sells both the Microclean replacement filter (app $100), and also a paper pleated filter (app $70).  Only thing I would add to this topic is that my original Microclean filter collapsed after about 1 month.  I'm assuming that it was because there was a LOT of stuff in my original fill water, including about a quadruple dose of liquid aroma, which probably plugged the filter & excess suction from trying to pull through it, collapsed it.  No water quality problems whatsoever, tho, in the 8 months I've had the tub, so I'm not too concerned!
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: anne on May 09, 2006, 11:18:08 am
Quote

Though hymba stated the MCII is the ONLY filter, I thought I read somewhere that there was an alternative.  Can anyone else confirm?



AP


There is a company called Micropure- they make a similar thing, but I have no idea if it would fit Sundance. Supposedly filter down to one micron, last 3-5 months and cost $25-30.
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: hymbaw on May 09, 2006, 11:25:34 am
Anne,
I believe they are refering to the 125 sq. ft. traditional pleated filter that Sundance used in the past. They are the same size as the Microclean II, so they do fit. They are not reccomended.
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: Spatech_tuo on May 09, 2006, 11:40:06 am
Quote
Anne,
I believe they are refering to the 125 sq. ft. traditional pleated filter that Sundance used in the past. They are the same size as the Microclean II, so they do fit. They are not reccomended.


Why aren't they recommended if they fit. Didn't they filter just fine previously? I thought that was a perfectly fine alternative if you don't want to be buying new filters every 9 months for $90 (therefore $10/month on disposable filters when you can use a traditional one for about 3 yrs at about $2/month)?

Am I misinterpreting something?
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: hymbaw on May 09, 2006, 12:06:53 pm
The tubs weren't designed for them. That should be enough for you, but I have a feeling it's not.

How about the fact that the circ. pump runs at 35 GPM as opposed to 5 GPM. Instead of cleaning your filter every 6 weeks you would have to clean it every 6 DAYS!
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: Spatech_tuo on May 09, 2006, 12:49:46 pm
Quote
The tubs weren't designed for them. That should be enough for you, but I have a feeling it's not.

How about the fact that the circ. pump runs at 35 GPM as opposed to 5 GPM. Instead of cleaning your filter every 6 weeks you would have to clean it every 6 DAYS!


I have ZERO issue with the micron filter other than the disposable part.  I'm not sure how the the regular filter would not be sufficient if the extra flow from the circ pump was too much for it I think the micron filter would have a problem first. Then again, you should know your product better than I. Too bad they can't make those micron fitlers so they can be cleaned and reused.
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: SerjicalStrike on May 09, 2006, 01:09:46 pm
The pleated filter was designed with 2 parts.  1 section for the ciirculation pump, and one for the 2 speed pump.  

The new filter has only 1 pump pulling through it because the filtration is totally separated from the main pump system.  That pump will pull unevenly through the filter because of how it is seaparated.  That is why it is not reccomended.

Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: hymbaw on May 09, 2006, 01:10:59 pm
Quote
Too bad they can't make those micron fitlers so they can be cleaned and reused.



The Microclean filter are "depth loading"(capturing particles all the way through the filter media) A pleated filter is "surface loading" (capturing particles on the surface)

You can clean the surface of a filter. I agree, it would be nice if you could clean the depths of a filter.

Until we figure out how, you just have to toss them.
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: shabba34 on May 09, 2006, 01:16:14 pm
Quote


The Microclean filter are "depth loading"(capturing particles all the way through the filter media) A pleated filter is "surface loading" (capturing particles on the surface)

You can clean the surface of a filter. I agree, it would be nice if you could clean the depths of a filter.

Until we figure out how, you just have to toss them.
Tri-X filters are both surface and depth loading and are able to be cleaned. ;)
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: Drewski on May 09, 2006, 01:17:46 pm
Quote
Why aren't they recommended if they fit. Didn't they filter just fine previously? I thought that was a perfectly fine alternative if you don't want to be buying new filters every 9 months for $90 (therefore $10/month on disposable filters when you can use a traditional one for about 3 yrs at about $2/month)?

Am I misinterpreting something?

I'm not a Sundance owner, but I did some research on this. Noblewinds, an Internet seller, has the following to say about the Sundance filter issue:

"The Unicel C-8326 Replaces both Sundance filters (Pleated 6540-501 & Micro-Fiber 6540-502)  with a single pleated filter.  The C-8380 replaces only the pleated 6540-501 Filter."

Here's the link (http://noblewinds.com/c-8326.html) to the replacement filter they indicate. Their price is $64.34 including shipping.

Quote
How about the fact that the circ. pump runs at 35 GPM as opposed to 5 GPM. Instead of cleaning your filter every 6 weeks you would have to clean it every 6 DAYS!

Again, with a little research, the "standard" formula I found for water flow rates through pleated cartridge filters was .375 GPM per square foot of cartridge media. OK, .375 X 125 SFT = 49 GPM, meaning a 35 GPM circ pump is still "in range?"  Am I reading this wrong?

Additionally, regardless of flow rate, if your water is dirty, it's DIRTY.  The change in flow rate only equates to the amount of TIME it takes to clean your water. So, to use a ridiculous example, if you have a 5 GPM circ pump, you get dirty water for 5 1/2 weeks until your filter finally overcomes it and gets "dirty" enough to clean. With a 35 GPM pump, it does the same process in 5 1/2 DAYS, after which you need to clean it.

What type of water would you rather have?

Drewski

8)
 


Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: windsurfdog on May 09, 2006, 01:18:20 pm
Quote
How about the fact that the circ. pump runs at 35 GPM as opposed to 5 GPM. Instead of cleaning your filter every 6 weeks you would have to clean it every 6 DAYS!

Are you suggesting that filters be cleaned every six weeks?  YIKES!  How 'bout biweekly?  Having 2 sets of filters that get switched and rinsed every 2 weeks seems like a better procedure to me...but that's just me.
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: hymbaw on May 09, 2006, 01:35:40 pm
Quote
Noblewinds, an Internet seller, has the following to say about the Sundance filter issue:

"The Unicel C-8326 Replaces both Sundance filters (Pleated 6540-501 & Micro-Fiber 6540-502)
 


I'm sure that Noblewinds knows more about Sundance spas than the people that design/build them. I already said that it will "fit".
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: hymbaw on May 09, 2006, 01:47:35 pm
Quote

Additionally, regardless of flow rate, if your water is dirty, it's DIRTY.  The change in flow rate only equates to the amount of TIME it takes to clean your water. So, to use a ridiculous example, if you have a 5 GPM circ pump, you get dirty water for 5 1/2 weeks until your filter finally overcomes it and gets "dirty" enough to clean. With a 35 GPM pump, it does the same process in 5 1/2 DAYS, after which you need to clean it.
Quote


Your quote above would have some validity if you never use your tub.
If you are using your tub daily you are continuosly adding waste to the water.
X amount of water through the filters and they are ready to clean. 5 GPM or 35 GPM which is ready for cleaning first? It's a no brainer.
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: SerjicalStrike on May 09, 2006, 02:33:46 pm
Quote
The pleated filter was designed with 2 parts.  1 section for the ciirculation pump, and one for the 2 speed pump.  

The new filter has only 1 pump pulling through it because the filtration is totally separated from the main pump system.  That pump will pull unevenly through the filter because of how it is seaparated.  That is why it is not reccomended.



This is why the filter will not work.  The filter that "fits" was designed as a 2 part filter.  1 section for the small circ pump, 1 section for the main pump.  The 2 part filter will replace the microclean 1, but not the microclean II.  
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: SerjicalStrike on May 09, 2006, 02:41:08 pm
Quote
Are you suggesting that filters be cleaned every six weeks?  YIKES!  How 'bout biweekly?  Having 2 sets of filters that get switched and rinsed every 2 weeks seems like a better procedure to me...but that's just me.


1 filter that gets replaced every 6-12 months seems easier to me.   But, it depends on what your time is worth.  

Pleated filters should be cleaned (if you can see them) when the pleats start to stick together or you notice a decrease in jet pressure.  Having a routine like every 2 weeks is nice because usually that keeps you ahead of the game.  
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: Drewski on May 09, 2006, 03:49:00 pm
Quote
Your quote above would have some validity if you never use your tub.  If you are using your tub daily you are continuosly adding waste to the water.
X amount of water through the filters and they are ready to clean. 5 GPM or 35 GPM which is ready for cleaning first? It's a no brainer.

Yeah, I know it's a no brainer.  BUT, it's for a different reason.  I doubt Sundance increased the circ pump flow rate to increase water turnover. After all, if the "new" filter is so great, why do you need to filter the tub volume so many times per day? I'm thinking they increased the GPM to increase PRESSURE, allowing the filter to still pass water as it clogs.

BUT, the "paper" filter also allows a flow rate of 35 GPM and higher pressure.  Maybe it won't clean the water as efficiently as a micron filter AND maybe it requires you to clean it more often, but is it more economical while providing the same benefit?

My point is this - do spa manufacturers add these features as a "marketing" ploy (WE have it, THEY don't), a reason to keep us consumers coming into the dealer's shop (you can only get this SPECIAL THING through the DEALER), or are they genuinely improving the performance of the product they make while at the same time reducing cost and effort to the consumer?

From some of what you said before, it sounds like the Sundance filter might almost last an entire year without replacement. If that's true (and I'd have to experience it at MY volume of use to believe it) you guys have a dynamite product!  If on the other hand, I'd have to replace it multiple times per year because it clogs easy, sorry, I'll stick with the tried and true method. If you didn't offer that method, I'd be sorely PO'd

So, when you said your customers are "averaging about 10 - 11 months on the MicroClean II" before replacement, does that mean you have some customers who only average 6 months?

Don't take me wrong here, I'm NOT trying to give you a hard time. It's just that a claim of filters lasting 10-11 months really makes me wonder. I'd definitely buy such a product if it performed as you advertise because you're absolutely right when you say the cost and time of cleaning filters adds up...

Drewski

8)
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: tony on May 09, 2006, 03:57:36 pm
There are more manufacturers than just Sundance that use a high volume circ pump.  What are they using for filters?  I'll bet a pleated filter.  A pleated filter will allow more to pass through than the 5 microns that the Microclean II filters allow.  I don't see why it would not work.  On the older SD systems, the pleated filter handled the two speed pump on high.  That's got to be more that 35 gallons per minute.  How about a pool pump with a cartridge filter?  Same thing there.
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: Spatech_tuo on May 09, 2006, 04:28:16 pm
Quote
There are more manufacturers than just Sundance that use a high volume circ pump.  What are they using for filters?  I'll bet a pleated filter.  A pleated filter will allow more to pass through than the 5 microns that the Microclean II filters allow.  I don't see why it would not work.  On the older SD systems, the pleated filter handled the two speed pump on high.  That's got to be more that 35 gallons per minute.  How about a pool pump with a cartridge filter?  Same thing there.


Well I'll admitt that those were my thoughts 1) others use similar circ pumps tied to pleated filters and 2) pleated filters would allow MORE flow so if they fit I don't see how they wouldn't work but I didn't want to come accross like I'm telling someone how their product works (maybe it's too late for that ;)).
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: SerjicalStrike on May 09, 2006, 04:45:30 pm
From our perspective, the microclean IIs lasted 9-12 months.  We had an issue with a few caving in in the beginning but were told it was a manufacturing problem.  Since then, 9-12 months has been the norm.  I have yet to see where it needed to be replaced every 6 months, but I am certain there are those where it is needed.  


From what I have experienced out in the field, the product is genuinely better.  The pumps pump at full force all the time, and the new circulation pump really moves the water around.  If you cut the circulation pump time down to 8 hours, you are still filtering more water at a higher rate than a 9gpm working for 24 hours.  You are also using less power. (If someone really wants me to do the math, I will) I am really hoping that Sundance will put the new circulation pump on the 780 line, but I don't see that happening.

I hope this clears up some of the confusion.
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: SerjicalStrike on May 09, 2006, 04:48:36 pm
Quote

Well I'll admitt that those were my thoughts 1) others use similar circ pumps tied to pleated filters and 2) pleated filters would allow MORE flow so if they fit I don't see how they wouldn't work but I didn't want to come accross like I'm telling someone how their product works (maybe it's too late for that ;)).


Look in the middle of a double ended 125sq. ft. filter.  There is a wall close to one side.  That section was used to handel the small circulation pump.  That wall is why you cannot use that filter.  
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: marks on May 09, 2006, 10:24:20 pm
Anne,

The Micropure filters are standard on Arctic tubs.  They say the filter will work on any tub that uses a pleated filter that has a 4-15/16" diameter, 13-5/16" length with a 2-1/8" center core.  They also eliminate the need for Clarifiers and Stain and Scale control.  I think it is an interesting product and am thinking of switching to them on my Beachcomber.
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: anne on May 10, 2006, 01:52:24 am
Quote
Anne,

The Micropure filters are standard on Arctic tubs.  They say the filter will work on any tub that uses a pleated filter that has a 4-15/16" diameter, 13-5/16" length with a 2-1/8" center core.  They also eliminate the need for Clarifiers and Stain and Scale control.  I think it is an interesting product and am thinking of switching to them on my Beachcomber.


Just be careful- its not just that they "eliminate the need" they also *strictly limit the use* of said products. Perhaps used with more experience then me, you need no clarifier. However, if you use stain and scale now, you wont be able to in the future, and there is nothing that the Micropure does that reduces calcium levels. Not everyone has hard water, so that might not be an issue. The rep that I spoke with said to keep an eye on their website, as a new carbon filter is coming out that will remove calcium. He thinks.

Dont get me wrong- I['m interested too, but at least for me, there are to many contraindications at the moment. My tub did come with one.
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: marks on May 10, 2006, 09:21:04 am
Anne,

I am definitely not an expert, just read the web site and talked to a representative.  The representative confirmed that you do not need and should not use any of the additives listed below.  I wonder who is correct? The web site states:

"Micron disposable filters are meant to last from 2-5 months depending on use and chemicals added. To get maximum filter life with crystal clear water you do not need to use enzymes, brighteners, clarifiers, coagulating agents, or stain & scale preventers. Your filters natural properties will attract oils and scum that go through standard filters, so you can decrease or stop the use of defoamers or other anti-foaming agents."
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: tony on May 10, 2006, 10:39:00 am
Quote

Look in the middle of a double ended 125sq. ft. filter.  There is a wall close to one side.  That section was used to handel the small circulation pump.  That wall is why you cannot use that filter.  


But there are pleated filters that will handle the configuration.  I am not questioning the superiority of the microcleanII filter, but I understand there is an option.  There is also an option for those who don't want to use the microclean I system.  It is a single pleated filter similar to the older type SD systems.
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: SerjicalStrike on May 10, 2006, 11:11:24 am
The double ended 125 sq. ft. filter will work for the microclean I filter setup.  They both separate the ciculation pump from the main pump.  

If there is a double ended 125 sq. ft. filter with no wall, then I don't see why that wouldn't work.
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: AAAAAAA on May 15, 2006, 09:30:40 am
Straight from the manual:

Your Sundance hot tub is equipped a high-efficiency MicroClean II filter cartridge under the filter lid (Figures G-J, Page 18-21). Debris is filtered by the circulation pump drawing water through this cartridge 24-hours a day, 7 days a week (unless programmed otherwise.) To ensure optimum
performance, replace this cartridge every 6 months or as needed. This filter cannot be cleaned and reused and MUST be thrown out after use.

ALSO from the manual:
Replacement MicroClean II filter cartridges may be purchased from your Sundance dealer. An optional pleated filter cartridge is also available from your Sundance dealer. This filter can be cleaned and reused for up to two years but does not maintain the same water quality and clarity as the standard MicroClean II cartridge.

Speaking of wich, what is the part number for microclean 2? I am trying to find a place online to purchase them since they are 200$ canadian from the dealer and they dont last me 12 months.
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: hymbaw on May 15, 2006, 11:54:34 am
Here's the Microclean II on ebay

http://cgi.ebay.com/Sundance-Spas-MicroClean-2-Filter-Cartridge-Micro-Clean_W0QQitemZ4452182025QQcategoryZ42240QQcmdZViewItem
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: Spatech_tuo on May 15, 2006, 12:07:15 pm
Quote
Straight from the manual:

Your Sundance hot tub is equipped a high-efficiency MicroClean II filter cartridge under the filter lid (Figures G-J, Page 18-21). Debris is filtered by the circulation pump drawing water through this cartridge 24-hours a day, 7 days a week (unless programmed otherwise.) To ensure optimum
performance, replace this cartridge every 6 months or as needed. This filter cannot be cleaned and reused and MUST be thrown out after use.

ALSO from the manual:
Replacement MicroClean II filter cartridges may be purchased from your Sundance dealer. An optional pleated filter cartridge is also available from your Sundance dealer. This filter can be cleaned and reused for up to two years but does not maintain the same water quality and clarity as the standard MicroClean II cartridge.



Wow, that's good information to see the manufacturer clearly states it's a viable option. I guess I can't get away from the "throw away" part of all of this plus you'll save some $$ over having to spend $90+ every 6 to 9 months.
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: johnvb on May 15, 2006, 12:49:55 pm
The throwaway filter came with my 05 Optima, but I bought one of the washable ones also. My disposable lasted 2 water changes (8 months).

I will warn you not to try and wash out the throwaway. I tried with mine after the first water change, and realized that it could be damaged.

It started to fall apart a few weeks prior to when I planned the second water change, so I used the washable one in the interim. If I hadn't messed with it on the first water change, it may have lasted longer, time will tell.

I paid around $75 for the disposable replacement. The time and energy I save not having to wash this thing is WELL WORTH IT!
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: Drewski on May 15, 2006, 12:53:42 pm
OK, let's summarize:

Quote
I wonder if you choose to not replace the microclean II filter and just let the regular filter do the work?

Quote
The MicroClean II is the ONLY filter on the 880 series tubs.

Quote
Anne, I believe they are refering to the 125 sq. ft. traditional pleated filter that Sundance used in the past. They are the same size as the Microclean II, so they do fit. They are not reccomended.

Quote
The tubs weren't designed for them. That should be enough for you, but I have a feeling it's not.

Quote
The pleated filter was designed with 2 parts.  1 section for the ciirculation pump, and one for the 2 speed pump. The new filter has only 1 pump pulling through it because the filtration is totally separated from the main pump system.  That pump will pull unevenly through the filter because of how it is seaparated.  That is why it is not reccomended.

Quote
I'm sure that Noblewinds knows more about Sundance spas than the people that design/build them. I already said that it will "fit".

Quote
This is why the filter will not work.  The filter that "fits" was designed as a 2 part filter.  1 section for the small circ pump, 1 section for the main pump.  The 2 part filter will replace the microclean 1, but not the microclean II.  

Quote
Look in the middle of a double ended 125sq. ft. filter.  There is a wall close to one side.  That section was used to handel the small circulation pump.  That wall is why you cannot use that filter.  

Quote
The double ended 125 sq. ft. filter will work for the microclean I filter setup.  They both separate the ciculation pump from the main pump. If there is a double ended 125 sq. ft. filter with no wall, then I don't see why that wouldn't work.

Quote
Straight from the manual:
Replacement MicroClean II filter cartridges may be purchased from your Sundance dealer. An optional pleated filter cartridge is also available from your Sundance dealer. This filter can be cleaned and reused for up to two years but does not maintain the same water quality and clarity as the standard MicroClean II cartridge.


If I'm a newbie looking at this discussion, I'm totally lost.

Now someone quotes the manual and SURPRISE, it says something else.

Why is THAT?

Drewski

???


Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: Spatech_tuo on May 15, 2006, 01:24:15 pm
Quote
If I'm a newbie looking at this discussion, I'm totally lost.

Now someone quotes the manual and SURPRISE, it says something else.

Why is THAT?

Drewski

 ???


Hmm, I wonder if he was quoting this year's manual. We might want to have that point made clear.
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: SerjicalStrike on May 15, 2006, 01:28:19 pm
He is quoting the correct manual.  Well, I guess that is what happens when the engineers don't talk to the marketing team :P

I can only say that what I am saying is what I was told from the engineers out at Sundance.  As far as the filter goes, I guess if it fits, it will work.
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: AAAAAAA on May 15, 2006, 01:50:30 pm
I quoted from the 05 maxxus manual.

I dont know about you guys but I trust the manual, its always steared me in the right direction. I will be following its advice.
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: galen on May 15, 2006, 02:25:17 pm
Well I sure wouldn't go by factory info. I called the factory about an issue with my remote. That controls the stereo sound levels, lights, pumps, air blower and sound syncrozations, that raises the level of sound when the pumps are on automatically. The Factory engineer said that the extra buttons were on there from other uses by other manufatures. Hymbaw said it will work. He was right. So this proves that the factory is not always right.
Title: Re: Sundance Filters
Post by: AAAAAAA on May 15, 2006, 02:30:33 pm
I just quit trying to use my remote. ;D