Hot Tub Forum
Original => Hot Tub Forum => Topic started by: stagehand on May 02, 2004, 03:56:07 pm
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Is there a site that, like the auto industry, shows spa invoice pricing vs. MSRP?
Don't vacuums, covers, lifters, chemicals, delivery etc. mask the real price of a spa? How about starting with a base and THEN add in items to build a price that's in the range you desire.
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Hi...
There is not... and what it seems that many people do not understand is that here in the US the Federal Government works with the Auto manufactures to determine fair MSRP....Also all dealers no matter what part of the country they are in must pay the same for the autos..MSRP must be inside any new car on a dealers lot usually on the window....MSRP will always be the same on each dealers lot...Also the auto industry has to meet fuel standards that is why they push for example small cars as their total number of Cars/Trucks sold in a particular state must average a minimum miles per gallon for ..The spa industry is far to small for the for government to regulate in the same way.....
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Most dealers I visited when looking for a spa earlier had the cover included in the price. Everything else was extra.
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Hi...
There is not... and what it seems that many people do not understand is that here in the US the Federal Government works with the Auto manufactures to determine fair MSRP.........
additionally, auto dealers "pay" less than "invoice" for a vehicle
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You cannot compare it to the auto industry as stated before the auto industry plays a whole different game with pricing and invoiced price.
Most dealers I know deal with add the extras in at a reduced cost and if you try to buy it separate you would pay much more. Items like a steps, cover lifts, chemical kits… is stuff the whether you realize it or not is stuff you need.
I do like what this one guy does though is he gives you a choice with and without the items, but he also shows you what you would pay for the extra if you bought later.
Gary
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Great feedback from everyone. Thank you. I feel now my strategy should be to not hammer price (well..just a little) but to pay a fair price and ask that the cover, cover-lifter, backup filter, delivery, chemicals and steps be included at no charge. I will try this strategy tomorrow. Again, thank you for the comprehensive information.
Mike
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Mike...
Good luck to you and be sure to wet test when you decide the spa you want check around here for what seems to be the fair market value of the spa you are looking at....I think that anything within 500.00 of someone elses price would be fair as what part of the country you are in will vary the price some what and also it is a little diffulcult to always compare the excat deal item for item with someone else...but you should be able to get an idea if you are close to what most people are paying.....again enjoy and good luck.... :D
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Done. I purchased a New Vita Hot Tub. Internet research puts them Top 5 in the world, Top 5 east coast, Top 10 west coast. 5 person spa MSRP $5,700, took advantage of $1,000 off aniverasry sale. Told dealer I would negotiate price or he could choose to include Tax, comp the delivery charge, comp the the cover, and include the cover lifter, got all the chemicals, and the steps. Also, received no charge back-up filters
Out the door $4,700. Naturally, I used the 2 other dealers in town as leverage. Thanks to the forum for helping me.
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I am confused stagehand. YOu basically paid full retail on your spa! Why didnt you negotiate? You could have easily saved another 1000 or 2000. The 1000 rebate came from the manufacture not the dealer. The dealer still had ALOT of markup which you paid!
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ok....needapsa go buy your spa and go home!!!!!!!!!!!! Stagehand is happy with his purchase and feels he paid a fair price that benefits both parties involved. at this rate you will NEVER own your coveted Sundance Optima.
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Stagehand....
Enjoy your new spa...and do yourself a big favor disregard needaspa...he forgot to mention that the 1000's of dollars you can save.... was just a number that floats in the vastness of his empty head...you see he started his search long a go and still has not brought a spa.... because the price he feels is fair is only so to himself.... enjoy the new spa...it sounds like a nice tub
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He didn't even say WHICH Vita he bought. Just the number of people it seats. There's NO WAY needaspa can identify retail price from your statements. Sounds like you got what you were looking for in a name brand UNDER the magic $5K figure. That's not easy to do. Enjoy your spa. We don't have a lot of Vita owners here so please continue to come back and tell us how you like it after you've had it a while. Congrats!
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Yes, Congrats on the new spa!!!
Enjoy!!!
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poolBOY,
'Stagehand is happy with his purchase and feels he paid a fair price that benefits both parties involved'
fair price - I dont think so! Paying full retail! Please stop talking like a greedy dealer!
'benefits both parties involved' - Yeah right! An intellectual comsumer is always looking for best price. What incentive is there for him to pay extra to benefit the dealer? Please dont say after the sale service, repairs, etc (typical trite sales tactics).
People, people, people - Any dealer can service any spa. Come on now, they are all the same mechanically!
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dabunka,
'He didn't even say WHICH Vita he bought. Just the number of people it seats. There's NO WAY needaspa can identify retail price from your statements.'
It doesnt matter that I know that. Do the math! He paid 4700 for the spa. Spas have a markup in general of 75%. That is 3500 in markup. Allow a fair (an generous profit of 500) profit which leaves 3000 he left on the table for the dealer to buy his porsche!
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Where do you get this idea that a $500 markup on something is fair and reasonable?
As Dr. Evil (Austin Powers) says:
"You just don't get it, do you Scotty?"
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Needaclue:
Sorry, but your estimate of a 75% markup is way off. I assure you I would have retired long ago if that was even a remote possibility.
There is a little thing called competition that keeps the margins down, and then there is a little thing called overhead that eats the margins up.
And in the case of HotSpring spas, if I sell a spa, I have to service it. That tends to make me want to sell in my service area only.
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"Scotty would you be an evil spa salesman"
Dr Evil
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Haha, yea, right! Dealer made $3,500 on a $4,700 sale. Good one! How old are you, 3? :o OK, now where's that great forum feature I like to use so much? Seems applicable for this need-for-attention guy.... Oh yea, there it is...................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................---------------------------------------->------------------>--------------------->------------>------->----->--->--> IGNORE!!!
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Needaclue:
Sorry, but your estimate of a 75% markup is way off. I assure you I would have retired long ago if that was even a remote possibility.
Could you imagine Chas a 75% markup? ;D For that matter, could you imagine a 40% markup? :-/
It would be like winning the lottery EVERYDAY!!
I don't think needsaclue understands business at all. He's proven that in many posts. It's not about gouging people, but about a profit margin that allows dealers to stay in business and support their customers AFTER the sale.
You know that needsaclue will be the first to run to his dealer and demand same-day service if something ever went wrong. But when he realizes his dealer isn't around because they didn't maintain a good enough profit margin, he'll slam the entire industry. We've all seen these sorts before and they read like an open book. I'm sure that "other dealer" will be more than happy to run right over immediately and fix it for a reasonable price! ;D
Hopefully, needsaclue has a farm so he never has to deal with those pesky middlemen grocery stores. Word has it, they make a profit too! ;)
Steve
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Hi Business Folks, :)
I thought I'd add some additional comparisons.
In the "high end" stereo business, the retail margin is almost always 40%, i.e. a product that the manufacturer charges $60 is to be sold for $100. It is typical across the country for these small dealers to give their good customers a 10% discount, selling the $60 cost item for $90. This is now a 33% margin. Some dealers occasionally provide their best customers a 15% discount, so that the $60 item is sold at $85. At this level, we have their best deal and a 29% margin.
It is a fact that most of these small dealers could not continue to operate at this level, if they sold to everyone at a 15% discount (which is selling at 29% margin). Most small businesses must operate above a 30% margin, in order to pay their G&A and other overhead expenses and eck out a small profit.
Now compare this to the world discount leaders - Walmart and Sam's Club. According to Sam Walton's book, they actually operate continuously at a 13% margin. This means that Walmart buys products at $87 and sells them for $100 every day. No other business in the world has ever come close to this feat and no one can compete with them. Think about the level of service and quality - it is mediocre across the board, but everyone knows what to expect. Of course, the majority of Americans have come to accept mediocre service as being normal. Most believe the Walmart level of service is actually quite good. It isn't.
Those who are over 60 years old can remember the level of service that was common in the 1950s and earlier. Such good service was possible and expected. Normal margins were 50%. Discounting was rare and not expected.
Times have changed!
Electro
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Hi Business Folks, :)
I This means that Walmart buys products at $87 and sells them for $100 every day. No other business in the world has ever come close to this feat and no one can compete with them.
Then there is the behind the scense way that Walmart increases its margins. What the vendor didn't dot 1 "i" on the invoice? Thats a 1% fine! What, you didn't get the email we only accept invoices from vendors with odd numbered zipcodes on the third Tuesday of months with R's in them? Thats a 10% fine. Then when they have you hooked they ask you to sell them items below cost so they can have a loss leader sale the day after Thanksgiving.