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Expectations for Monthly Cost with BullFrog X7L

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d00nut:
I think a better way to look at energy efficiency is actual electrical draw... not dollars.  Obviously, that is what we care about, but everyone is on a different plan.

Bottom line is, there is a lot of factors that go into retaining heat.  All the hot tubs are generally equally as bad at generating the heat, it comes down to slowing down the heat loss.

More insulation = better heat retention
Better Cover (talking density and seal) = better heat retention
What kind of base it's on matters

You could also talk a bit about how much it filters, but that is really it.

Bullfrogs use the 1/2 polyurethane foam, and it is pretty much fully foamed all the way around except the equipment cabinet (which is generally what you want to prevent your pumps from overheating.)

It's a well built and efficient hot tub.  :)

swilly1000:

--- Quote from: Hottubguy on February 18, 2019, 10:37:01 pm ---Neither look like full foam to me. What’s that reflective material in the equipment area?  What kind of tub are those pictures of?

--- End quote ---

The one with the reflective material (not sure exactly what it is) is my Master Twilight Series 8.25.  The other one is a Master spa model (can't recall which one) on the floor at the dealer

bachman:
With tub energy use, heat loss, insulation, cover quality and other factors, I understand the interests or concerns for any owner or prospective shopper/buyer.
Some will be case by case situations with certain brands or line within a brand that are lacking the cold weather kit due to cost cutting or quality variations to meet a price point. In some climates, those tubs probably won't be a problem and might in fact be a "good buy" considering the application and environment. Heck, some tubs go indoors and many climates have little to no winter.

In more extreme climates, I think it's fundamental to research and make sure one gets the right tub and design / quality but even at that, I think it's a great point as mentioned concerning the many variables of how and where the tub is set up.  Wind abatement, open air setting like on a deck with air flow and cold on the under side etc.... Those would be considerations in my case where I'd research more for the better insulated and those brands that carry favorable ratings in the coldest winter areas.

I don't consider my area extreme winter but my shopping would have steered us toward the better brands and quality tubs so my end result would likely have been a decent or well-insulated brand and model. I say "would have" since we were gifted a tub and had no say in the matter.   ;)
I respect good salesmanship and good quality but unless I was convinced I was getting a sub par brand or model, I likely would not have been 'stepped up' to pay a premium price just to get better insulation for where I live. It's mostly a mild winter here, my tub sits 6 feet from the house east, 3 feet from a solid fence south and it's on a paver stone patio. We do at times, get a brisk N or NW wind that's b*tchy and it does hit the front of the tub where the access panel is so I may add some foam rubber behind the panel leaving factory vents as is. On this access side, I see nothing in the way of insulation except just along the edging where it's padded to create a snug seal. I suppose it can't hurt that the one pump runs every so often and even at low speed or tiny amp draw, may generate some heat. The cavity under there is always quite warm since the tub water generates some heat transfer (as energy loss) from the shell.
I've yet to pull the skirting off my tub for the other 3 panels so I'll be interested to look into it when the weather gets nicer just to see and compare. I recall mentions of Marquis being a good brand and well built but I know nothing of how standards or energy efficiency has changed or improved over the years and mine is 14 years old.

Tman122:
Some say that 80-90 percent of heat loss is through the top.

I did some infrared observations with an electrical cooperative assessment guy on one of my tubs and the stat seems close to true.

Spatech_tuo:

--- Quote from: Tman122 on February 19, 2019, 07:44:54 am ---Some say that 80-90 percent of heat loss is through the top.

I did some infrared observations with an electrical cooperative assessment guy on one of my tubs and the stat seems close to true.

--- End quote ---

i think that's true when he spa is pretty well insulated. If the spa is poorly insulated much more than 10% of its lost energy is escaping from the sides/bottom.

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