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Author Topic: White flakes in water.  (Read 6056 times)

drober30

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White flakes in water.
« on: March 11, 2006, 03:53:47 PM »
I just drained the spa, washed the shell with shell cleaner, nice and sudsy! Rinsed it out really good then filled with new water through the fresh water pre-filter from HS.

I went out and checked the level which is half way now and noticed pieces of white flakey looking things in the water.

Anybody experiences this?

I think I will go buy new filters anyway even though mine are only 10 months old.h

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White flakes in water.
« on: March 11, 2006, 03:53:47 PM »

drober30

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Re: White flakes in water.
« Reply #1 on: March 11, 2006, 05:00:40 PM »
I went to the HS dealer with a water sample. There was a guy there who was knowledgeable regarding water chemistry. Without even looking at the water sample he assured me it was scale.

He advised that I add stain and scale control to remove the scale. He said it would dissolve and I did not need to drain the tub that bathing would be just fine and the scale would be gone.

He told me to add the entire bottle but the bottle states to add about four capfuls. To give you an idea on size there are about 100 capfuls in the bottle.

He also steered me away from the chlorine while using ozone and silver ion. He said I should use one tsp of chlorine to activate the silver ion and then just use MPS.

He said chlorine will give me a false PH reading especially as much as Iíve been using. I was adding two tsp every time I got out of the tub. The same routine I think many on this forum use. I read through the Verminator and the Northman directions and was happy with my routine but may try the MPS route for the next three months till my next water change.

Please comment on the scale issue and let me know if you have ever dealt with this? Should I pour in the whole bottle?

East_TX_Spa

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Re: White flakes in water.
« Reply #2 on: March 11, 2006, 05:04:52 PM »
I would go by what the bottle says and if that doesn't do the trick, I would adjust accordingly.  I don't know if adding the whole bottle would mess up the water chemistry, probably not, but it's better to err on the side of caution.  I hope it works and your water gets better. :)

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tugoodtobetrue

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Re: White flakes in water.
« Reply #3 on: March 11, 2006, 05:15:49 PM »
Check directions on back of bottle,might be both INITIAL TREATMENT and WEEKLY/MAINTENANCE dosages. Some brands are a 2-part system(Biolab/Guardex) 8)

Vinny

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Re: White flakes in water.
« Reply #4 on: March 11, 2006, 05:29:21 PM »
What's your PH, Alk and Calcium levels? This will determine if it's scale.

Don't believe anyone who tells you NOT to use a sanitizer!

MPS and N2 will not sanitize your tub. Maybe Activate is a combo MPS/Chlorine, if not I'd seek out other advice.

drober30

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Re: White flakes in water.
« Reply #5 on: March 11, 2006, 06:00:29 PM »
I added about three times the normal does. I'm sure he recommended so much because he thought I had build up.

The weekly maintenance is four capfuls. I try to add the least amount of stuff to my water as possible but will probable include the stain and scale control to my weekly routine.

As far as the sanitizer goes... I am supposed to be using the Fresh Water system... Ozone, Silver Ion and MPS with a weekly shock of either MPS or Dichlor.

The Silver Ion, Ozone and MPS should keep my tub clean and sanitized according to the HS manual. However, it does state that I can shock with Dichlor instead of MPS and thatís what I will use.

So MPS before use and a weekly dose (2 1/4 tsp) of Dichlor. This is how the HS manual states the Fresh Water system should operate.

I always noticed a smell when removing the cover and the guy at the HS store said that will go away using the recommended Fresh Water method.

Well, I can surely try it for three or four months and see for myself which one works better.

My water was always crystal clear using straight Dichlor and the guy at the HS dealer said he did not doubt it with as much Dichlor as I was dumping in.

When I say straight Dichlor, I was still running Ozone and Silver Ion.


« Last Edit: March 11, 2006, 06:03:01 PM by drober30 »

HotTubMan

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Re: White flakes in water.
« Reply #6 on: March 11, 2006, 06:27:59 PM »
I recently had a conversation with a gentleman with a doctorite in chemistry regarding this very issue.

He suggested one of two possible solutions.

1. Add soft water. The soft water would naturally extract the calcium from the plumbing, heater etc.

2. Make the tub acidic. Drop the pH to a level lower than 7 for a period of a week or two. This will cause the calcium to dissolve.

I would assume that adding the entire bottle of scale inhtibitor would acheive the goal in option #2.

Yes, it may be a little hard on the tub, especially seals and gaskets. That being said a condition of scaling is not healthy either and most of the "damage" would be done to the scale we are aiming to remove.
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Chas

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Re: White flakes in water.
« Reply #7 on: March 11, 2006, 07:07:50 PM »
Calcium is gritty and feels alot like sand. It clings to the side - as it gets rubbed off or falls off it settles to the bottom and looks like like tan sand.

You don't technically 'get rid' of that, you just sort of put it back into the water by lowering your pH and TA and holding it low for a few days.

You also could have water mold, which looks more like somebody dropped a tissue into the water. It floats around, clogs filters, and falls apart if you pick it out with your hand. You get rid of that with a two-step approach: Filtration and chlorination. Chlorine shock the life out it and clean your filters alot for several days.

OR,

Somebody might have dropped a tissue in your spa - or the label off the underside of the cover, or some other paper thinngy.

Former HotSpring Dealer - Southern Cal.

drober30

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Re: White flakes in water.
« Reply #8 on: March 11, 2006, 11:40:44 PM »
Quote
Calcium is gritty and feels alot like sand. It clings to the side - as it gets rubbed off or falls off it settles to the bottom and looks like like tan sand.

You don't technically 'get rid' of that, you just sort of put it back into the water by lowering your pH and TA and holding it low for a few days.

You also could have water mold, which looks more like somebody dropped a tissue into the water. It floats around, clogs filters, and falls apart if you pick it out with your hand. You get rid of that with a two-step approach: Filtration and chlorination. Chlorine shock the life out it and clean your filters alot for several days.

OR,

Somebody might have dropped a tissue in your spa - or the label off the underside of the cover, or some other paper thinngy.



Chas I was much happier without the water mold theory. :o

There were several small pieces of white flakes, like fish food, floating at the surface.

When you said itís like someone dropped a tissue do you mean that it looks like the tissue was still intact or broke apart like I'm describing?

I will check the tag under the cover in the morning. I know there is a tag that says Vanguard.

I doubt it can be anything that Dichlor would prevent because I shocked my tub hard on a weekly basis. After a shock treatment I could not use my tub for two days until the Dichlor level came down.

Also remember this is a fresh water fill. I did not even run the jets before seeing this stuff.

Chas

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Re: White flakes in water.
« Reply #9 on: March 12, 2006, 12:12:44 AM »
Water mold looks like a tissue which has broken up.

The labels on some of our covers do tend to fall apart...
especially if you have ozone.

Former HotSpring Dealer - Southern Cal.

jim97219

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Re: White flakes in water.
« Reply #10 on: March 12, 2006, 02:02:30 AM »
This is going to sound stupid as all get-out but here's what happened to me. I've had my tub, a Hydropool 638, for a whole month now.  The tub has a built-in bromine dispensing system that uses a platic tub to hold the tablets that sits inside the filter canister.  Given that I'm using dichlor and given that I wet-tested my tub at my dealer's, I never thought about opening up that canister.

So when I went to clean the filter this morning, I opened the filter canister for the first time and found the instructions for the dispensing system rolled up inside that tube.  They were wet but intact so nothing went through the filter but I wonder if it's possible something like that--or worse--happened to you.  

Jim

drober30

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Re: White flakes in water.
« Reply #11 on: March 12, 2006, 12:45:43 PM »
Quote
Water mold looks like a tissue which has broken up.

The labels on some of our covers do tend to fall apart...
especially if you have ozone.



Ok, I come to the realization that there is no way that I have any water mold or bacteria or anything I should worry about and there are a couple of reasons why:

1. Chas, once again your knowledge has helped me out. The tag had deteriated and there was not much of it even left. I grab what was left and a white hard flaky piece came off in my hand. What that did for me was clearly identify what my wife and I had seen in the tub before.

Now what I was talking about in this thread could have been the tag after being in the water for months and breaking down even more. Number two will explain.

2. For the good of the forum I will admit my dumb A*S mistake.   :-[  I drained my tub, scrubbed the shell and then filled the tub back up. If you read closely you will see I donít mention cleaning the filters!

I filled the tub up through the filter compartment with the old dirty filters still in the tub. I'm sure that the stuff I seen was from the dirty filters. Could have been the tag, after all the tag was big and it was all but missing at this point, or it could have been just other debris but nonetheless I feel thatís where my problem came from.

I drained the tub again, purchased new TRI-X filters and am in the process of filling it.

I have changed the water in my tub a few times with complete success but every time I removed the filters and cleaned them good.

Iíll let everyone know after the tub is full.

drober30

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Re: White flakes in water.
« Reply #12 on: March 12, 2006, 09:51:50 PM »
Tub water looks sparkling clean!

For those of you with a tag under the cover I would recommend removing it.

A thanks again for everyoneís input and help!

J._McD

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Re: White flakes in water.
« Reply #13 on: March 12, 2006, 10:47:35 PM »
I agree with Chas, water mold, paper mold, flakes, it is called a number of different things and it is inorganic material that has adhered to the interior of the pvc plumbing.  It is consistent with draining the tub for a short period of time before refilling.  Like mud in a dry river bed that dries up and the mud cracks open, the material in the plumbing does the same thing in the plumbing.  When the tub is refilled it reconstitues and flakes off of the interior of the plumbing.

Chances are, you have not seen the last of it.  Super chlorination would be the cure.  You want to clean the interior of the plumbing with high levels of chlorine.

Because it is called "mold" it is not a living substance, it is inorganic, and it is in the interior of the pvc.  If it continues to persist, I would recommend removing the filters to obtain maximum water flow through the plumbing systems without restriction while super chlorinating the water.  Run it for 24 hours to clean out the lines, changing any diverters to clean all systems and put your filters back in to capture and clean the water.

If you leave the filters in, it will accumulate and clog the filters, restricting the water flow and do a half a$$ job.

Chances are you also have ozone on the Hot Tub.

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Re: White flakes in water.
« Reply #13 on: March 12, 2006, 10:47:35 PM »

 

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